Twitch Upcoming!

We're delaying our Twitch till AFTER a very specific KS update. You'll know what one, we'll talk about the twitch in the update. We need all hands to get this one ready.
Which still means something good is coming.
https://www.twitch.tv/missingworldsmedia

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the Mogul, `tis I

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Radiac
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the Mogul, `tis I

I just got an email from the devs telling me that my Mogul building has had it's neighborhood decided upon. I'm very excited about this and would like to share that with everyone here. Rome wasn't built in a day, and there are like 100-ish Mogul buildings to make, locate and fit into the city, so I'm really happy that this part of the project is progressing at a good pace and that I got my first choice in terms of what I asked for. I'm totally psyched to hear that they're going to be in touch in the future regarding the design, as I had some thoughts on that which I couldn't really go into detail about in the last thing I filled out for it. So thank you MWM for making this game and for the awesome news update on my Mogul building.

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Kiyori Anoyui
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Samesies!! :D

Samesies!! :D

I don't know how classified the info is supposed to be, as they are most likely subject to change.

But what is the vibe of your building/neighborhood that yours will be residing in? My vibe is very tech savvy skyscraper, imagine the Avengers base, Stark Industries style but with an oriental feel. I'm looking forward to getting the process started!

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Spent many hours determining

Spent many hours determining neighborhoods.....

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Got my notice as well! Looks

Got my notice as well! Looks like a [ fnord ] is going up at [ fnord ]! Or maybe on [ fnord ] in [ fnord ].

(Not sure how much nondisclosure you're wanting on these. Playing it safe. ^_^)

Also, the link to the landmarks page in the KSX section still seems to be broken...

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I envy anyone who had the

I envy anyone who had the means and the foresight to make a Mogul level Kickstarter commitment. I think you are going to wind up with something very unique and enjoyable that will put your personal stamp in the game from day one. I know that MWM has expressed some regret over the workload bottleneck this has created, but I share your enthusiasm on the progress and the knowledge they are pushing through.

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Got my notification too, and

Got my notification too, and also got my first choice!

Based on the neighborhood descriptions they sent with the notifications, my building will be in a post release neighborhood so looks like I might not have access to it on day one, but the neighborhood sounds very interesting and very fitting.

Can't wait!

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Doctor Tyche wrote:
Doctor Tyche wrote:

Spent many hours determining neighborhoods.....

I can imagine, I feel like that would be one of the most difficult decisions to make because once that is set in stone it would be difficult to make any changes to it after that.

@Omegawatt, I'm sure I've seen it before if it was sent out but is there a list of neighborhoods set for release?

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Kiyori Anoyui wrote:
Kiyori Anoyui wrote:

@Omegawatt, I'm sure I've seen it before if it was sent out but is there a list of neighborhoods set for release?

Not sure if there is a formal list of neighborhoods set for release, but the description of the neighborhood my mogul building is in included the phrase, "a post-launch district," which I took to mean something that will be added in an expansion.

In response to your earlier inquiry - based on it's description, I picture the neighborhood my building will be in as something similar to Croatoa or perhaps Dark Astoria.

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Fire Away wrote:
Fire Away wrote:

I envy anyone who had the means and the foresight to make a Mogul level Kickstarter commitment. I think you are going to wind up with something very unique and enjoyable that will put your personal stamp in the game from day one. I know that MWM has expressed some regret over the workload bottleneck this has created, but I share your enthusiasm on the progress and the knowledge they are pushing through.

I second this. I came too late to the party and I hope you moguls get great satisfaction for the courage you displayed putting your own money down so early.

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I'm not a Mogul by any

I'm not a Mogul by any stretch of the imagination, but I'm very happy about some of the buildings I had a hand in ensuring existed.

That's not too much of a headache. Though considering in this case, "much" is essentially 3.141592(ei- ie) over 0.

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Have checked with Warcabbit,

Have checked with Warcabbit, say whatever you like about your buildings

One thing he wanted me to mention: if you see the phrase "post launch district" this signifies something that is aimed at issues 1 or 2 (basically as soon as we can).

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key word "say"? IE no photos?

key word "say"? IE no photos? Not a mogul just being a pain in the bottom.

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Grimfox wrote:
Grimfox wrote:

key word "say"? IE no photos? Not a mogul just being a pain in the bottom.

If you have pics, you can share them, some do some don't

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Ah, my FoI request has been

Ah, my FoI request has been approved! Here's the unredacted version:

Quote:

Looks like a hotel is going up at Victory Beach! Or maybe on Daybreak Ridge in Aurora.

It will be basically cylindrical, with an open center for the pool area, and covered by a geodesic dome. My intent was that it would be a nice place to hang out in, if the interior can be made accessible, and also a place for residential (penthouses!) and/or super bases (hiding under the underground parking).

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My mogul building idea was

My mogul building idea was that it would be a radio station, with a large neon sign, that reads "RADIO STATION WASD" on one line of signage text, possibly with a name like "TITAN CITY" above that, or maybe "RADIANT" or "RADICAL" or something. The joke being that we use the WASD keys to move around in most MMOs and that those letters are also a valid east-coast radio call letter set. They told me that there might be FCC issues (i.e. someone probably already has those call letters in the real world) and we might have to modify that a little. Considering that we, City of Titans, are not an actual radio station, or broadcasting station of any kind, it might not be an issue at all, I don't know. At the very least, I think we'd have to make sure the building's advertizing doesn't look anything like the real WASD, I would expect. Or maybe you have to add an "x" onto the end, making it WASDX, I think someone mentioned that as a thing.

The sign will have the words "RADIO STATION" all on the same line of text, and the letter "O" in RADIO will not light up, or will by very twitchy, as will the letters "ST" in STATION. So as such, when the letters are lit, like at night, it will read, in bright green, I hope, "RADI ATION WASD" or something like that, meaning or implying "radiation in all directions" essentially. Lastly, and this was not on my description originally, but I hope to add it, I would want the sign to have a logo depicting a radio broadcast antenna with concentric neon circles around the top point. Those circles will be in segments of 60 degrees of arc such that each "bulb" will represent one sixth of the full circle. When all of the bulbs are lit, it will look like a radio antenna with concentric "air waves" surrounding the top point, but at night, when the twitchy bulbs go out, it will look like Radiac's chest symbol, the international symbol for "Danger Radiation" which is the familiar 3-bladed logo on my costume. In green neon, I hope.

That's my current idea, anyway, we'll see what we can actually get. I'm currently super psyched though.

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Radiac wrote:
Radiac wrote:

My mogul building idea was that it would be a radio station, with a large neon sign, that reads "RADIO STATION WASD" on one line of signage text, possibly with a name like "TITAN CITY" above that, or maybe "RADIANT" or "RADICAL" or something. The joke being that we use the WASD keys to move around in most MMOs and that those letters are also a valid east-coast radio call letter set. They told me that there might be FCC issues (i.e. someone probably already has those call letters in the real world) and we might have to modify that a little.

Check out http://wasdradio.com/
and their kickstarter page here:
https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/2138145515/wasd-radio-developer-and-gamer-centric-online-radi

I think that since WASD is a gamer-centric radio station, there could be some very real business synergy between them and MWM's City of Titans. I would like to see that happen.

...and if that doesn't pan out, I think WMWM would be a cool channel designation for some media staion in Titan City.

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I believe there is an actual

I believe there is an actual WASD radio station somewhere on the US east coast too. Or maybe there was? I don't have the specifics.

Anyway, that's just ONE problem, and hopefully one that could be fixed by adding the X at the end if we have to. The signage itself is another, in terms of the different neon bulbs being a thing that would have to get made in 3D, then light on and off at different times of day differently, or just have some that twitch, etc. Also, the idea of having a logo that turns the radio tower into a radiation symbol might have come up elsewhere too, not sure how that would work, in terms of copyrights etc. Can one copyright the idea of having a radio tower that looks like a radiation symbol as a logo? I mean it's not exactly the golden arches, and that radiation danger symbol is, I believe, public domain, as it is a safety thing. CoX had that as a chest symbol option, and the Simpsons used it for Radioactive Man, plus it was the chest symbol for a comicbook character or two (Solar, Man of the Atom, comes to mind as I type this).

Another idea I came up with was to have the radio station only occupy the upper floors of the building and have a restaurant on the ground level, if its in a neighborhood where that wouldn't look out of place. Sticking with the "MMO keyboard" theme, you could have a Planet Hollywood type themed place that has a retro 1950s "Zoom off to space in a space rocket" theme called "The Space Bar" with rockets and planets adorning the walls, window dressing, etc.

These are all just ideas, I don't know how much of it we can really do. Hopefully some of my other Kickstarter Perks can be folded into that same area. I paid for Fashionista (with the Mogul add on thrown in on top...), so I get a lot of other stuff, including an NPC, which could easily end up being Radiac, in full spandex or civilian clothes, standing around outside the station, handing out missions or something. My Exploration Badge could be under the neon sign on the roof, with a neat sort of jumping puzzle to get to up to it, if you can't fly, or maybe there's enough rigging that walking around the roof is like a maze to get to the Exploration Badge foot stone marker, etc. Theoretically my personal lair entrance could hopefully be a door on that building too.

So what I guess I'm saying is, the whole game should be about ME for the most part... ;)

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An alternative to WASD would

An alternative to WASD would be WERD, which is actually the keybind combo I use in lieu of WASD. Unfortunately, you wouldn't get the flickering light joke out of that like you explained ... :(


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That idea sounds really cool

That idea sounds really cool Radiac!

What I am hoping for is a very tech-centric building, as far as the inside adorning is concerned. The purpose of the building is weapon/tech innovation. In the hopes that there will be inside access of the building, people will be able to come in and see all the newest and greatest in tech. And in the slightest chance that our buildings can actually be used in the game, you will be able to buy stuff(pretty much a Tech shop where you could buy enhancements in CoX, or something of this sort).

I have a whole story made up where Kiyori's father created a factory out in Foxtown called Takumi Industries. It was in the business of producing and selling weapons(back in the CoX times). My father created a group of non super-powered individuals with the goal to tackle the big enemy group of the area and they used my fathers weapons to fight. Around the time of the hurricane, the big enemy group tried to take advantage of the situation and pull a heist of all the weapons. The mastermind behind the heist was actually my mom. But you'll learn more about that later(exploration badge in game perhaps). The final stand was inside Takumi Industries and the situation was perilous when the building caught fire. Unbeknownst to my parents I was there at the time, I was in my fathers office when it started to cave in. My cry for help broke up the fight between my parents. My father immediately ran to the office to rescue me. He was able to rescue me but as we were exiting the building there was an explosion. My father died that day, my mother was never found...

I inherited the business and continue his legacy. With the insurance money from the old building, I decided to build the new building somewhere where innovation thrived, Tokki Row. The construction of the building will be very sleek and conical. Going down from the top the conical figure will break out on both sides with curved sections going all the way down to the ground. Almost like wings hugging the main section of the body. *Some say the building resembles a phoenix rising from the ashes.* The curved wings of the building have water cascading down the sides that feed into a body of water(pond, river, sea, tbd). Directly behind the building there will be a path down to a shrine in the water. This area will be very misty and the shrine is in honor of Takumi. The building represents remembering the past but looking to the future.

I got the Lethal Weapon perk in Kickstarter so I think this will be a good fit for this concept. I have not nailed down a concept for a weapon yet but hopefully it will integrate into the story. (Maybe it was my fathers prototype that I brought to reality or something.) The I know a guy perk and exploration badge I am hoping will be down in the shrine and it will be Takumi. He will take you into missions that will recount the events leading up to his death.

These are all of my hopes, I don't know how much of this can and will actually happen but I am looking forward to it none the less!

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There are 6 ways to arrange

There are 6 ways to arrange the letters WASD such that you get a recognizable radio call letter set:

WASD
WSAD
WDAS
WDSA
WADS
WSDA

If I can't have WASD, I think I like WADS the best of the remaining choices. Then the sign would read "RADI ATION WADS". Wads of radiation! And still in all directions, but not in the usual order. :)

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How about "Radio WENS" and

How about "Radio WENS" and variations for actual map directions?

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Spoken out I like WSAD, I don

Spoken out I like WSAD, I don't really see why any of them would be an issue. But I guess I'm no expert on the fine print.

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I wanted to evoke the "gamer"

I wanted to evoke the "gamer" aspect though. This is a game, games use those 4 keys, usually. I mean, a lot of gaming keyboards have those 4 keys set up in different colors, etc to highlight that fact.

Example:

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My Mogul concept was posted

My Mogul concept was posted previously in the Kickstarter threads. It's Mischief's Ascent, the towering building with a "space needle" like structure at the top that will be an enclosed garden around the central building. Plants, fountains, flames, and striking architecture (we'll see what they incorporate). The idea of it is to have an Angel and a Demon chained together or clasping hands/arms, holding up that top structure on their shoulders - a sort of Duality of Hero/Villain and the internal struggle of both for Right and Wrong... Also a tribute to my late wife. Excited to see it progress.

I (last year) received my letter indicating the 3D modeler (Copper) was going to start a first pass and contact me directly. I have not, as of yet, been contacted at Copper. I would imagine they are working through a bow wave of Moguls.

It's great to see the progress and to see the potential for additional support to the project.

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Insatiable wrote:
Insatiable wrote:

My Mogul concept was posted previously in the Kickstarter threads. It's Mischief's Ascent, the towering building with a "space needle" like structure at the top that will be an enclosed garden around the central building. Plants, fountains, flames, and striking architecture (we'll see what they incorporate). The idea of it is to have an Angel and a Demon chained together or clasping hands/arms, holding up that top structure on their shoulders - a sort of Duality of Hero/Villain and the internal struggle of both for Right and Wrong... Also a tribute to my late wife. Excited to see it progress.
I (last year) received my letter indicating the 3D modeler (Copper) was going to start a first pass and contact me directly. I have not, as of yet, been contacted at Copper. I would imagine they are working through a bow wave of Moguls.
It's great to see the progress and to see the potential for additional support to the project.

Ha, I just went over your block placement yesterday morning!

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I recall the concept art for

I recall the concept art for that structure. It looked great. Thanks for donating. I think, correct me if I'm wrong DT, awhile back they had a change in the development team that was working on the mogul buildings. From there we haven't heard much about their development. Which could mean a variety of things. Everything from work was backburnered, to, as you suggest, they are just working on other mogul buildings. I did not donate at that level, for a variety of reasons, but I would like to see an update on these signature buildings in the city. At the very least, what do you mean by "block placement" DT?

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Making a list of which blocks

Making a list of which blocks are available in the right district of the right size/environment.

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Ah, Thanks for the "very

Ah, Thanks for the "very least" DT! :P

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Grimfox wrote:
Grimfox wrote:

I recall the concept art for that structure. It looked great. Thanks for donating. I think, correct me if I'm wrong DT, awhile back they had a change in the development team that was working on the mogul buildings. From there we haven't heard much about their development. Which could mean a variety of things. Everything from work was backburnered, to, as you suggest, they are just working on other mogul buildings.

I had gotten an email awhile back from Carol and William saying they will be working on the mogul buildings. This was back in April and I haven't heard anything since so this might not be the case anymore, who knows ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

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Doctor Tyche wrote:
Doctor Tyche wrote:

Ha, I just went over your block placement yesterday morning!

Now that is exciting!

Curious to see where it will land. It's fantastic to watch the progress of this game!

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I also got an e-mail some

I also got an e-mail some time ago indicating Carol and Williams are working on this, but for some reason for my e-mails were bouncing to their e-mail addresses. That I believe has been resolved now, and I am excited to know where my building will be (and sounds it is going to be in a preliminary zone.

"Future Fusion" (with a sign indicating it is a "A Division of Triumph Industries"), described as "I would like to have it be a scientific "campus" (spread rather than height) in the Innovation Center section of N.R.D. It is a scientific think tank so definitely futuristic architecture and landscaping of the campus grounds. The presence of the base is a "well known secret" base of Fusion Force - not advertised on the outside but the jet bay etc. are not well hidden. Prominent colors would be green, gold and white.

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Tempest wrote:
Tempest wrote:

I also got an e-mail some time ago indicating Carol and Williams are working on this, but for some reason for my e-mails were bouncing to their e-mail addresses. That I believe has been resolved now, and I am excited to know where my building will be (and sounds it is going to be in a preliminary zone.

Yeah, my building is not in the starting zones so I'm not too worried about it right now. I did like the part in the new update about the building/city design. I hope to see a little more of that on the upcoming twitch live streams. Maybe we could even get a glimpse at some custom Mogul building work?

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I sure hope that the 2nd

I sure hope that the 2nd crowdfunding event comes soon. Tabby City *needs* a state-of-the-art veterinary hospital!

You know that you were ALL thinking that! Am I right?!

Make it so!

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Hmm, I kind of forgot about

Hmm, I kind of forgot about this... Ah well, never really thought it'd happen.

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Kaemgen! Welcome back?

Kaemgen! Welcome back?

Be Well!
Fireheart

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*squees*

*squees*

Welcome back!

*purrs loudly and proudly*

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soooooooo..... what kind of

soooooooo..... what kind of building are you planning on making? :]

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Thanks, thanks... though not

Thanks, thanks... though not really back, more just poked my head in to look around and be grumpy.

Not Ears - Umm, I'm not holding my breath on having a building.

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*I* am hoping to have a

*I* am hoping to have a veterinary hospital in a Kings Row-type area!

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Just looked back at my Mogul

Just looked back at my Mogul mail and it looked looks like I am getting a big museum located in the museum district (figures).
I asked for something like Natural History Museum with dinosaur skeletons,display cases,gas lamps,etc so hopefully will make a moody lair for me and possibly an SG.
Should I have had more contact since or is it a slow roll out?
See you in game lol.

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Is it really true there won't

Is it really true there won't be a Mogul option in the 2nd chance Kickstarter? I had my heart set on a cute little farmhouse with a multi-story bunker hidden beneath :(

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Tinkhard wrote:
Tinkhard wrote:

Is it really true there won't be a Mogul option in the 2nd chance Kickstarter? I had my heart set on a cute little farmhouse with a multi-story bunker hidden beneath :(

I'm not sure if the "news" about this is true but I would not be surprised if it is. When you think about it the amount of time/effort involved in creating each unique Mogul site is probably fairly prohibitive and was probably among the most time consuming things they offered to do during the initial Kickstarter.

At this point the Devs have made it pretty clear that their main goal with offering the 2nd chance Kickstarter was to gain funds to hire more people to get the game going ASAP. I still think there's a possibility they might offer Mogul upgrades AFTER launch - at least it would be much easier for them to add new ones into the game after launch than right at the moment they are racing to get the game going at all.

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yeah the mogul perk was a big

yeah the mogul perk was a big mistake in hindsight... making a custom building from scratch is way harder than making a prop or material from scratch, and now the devs have to sleep in the bed they made... once they hire these new people, the mogul building should go faster but, their definably has to be a better replacement for mogul buildings so that this mistake never happens again... luckily there's a whole suggestion thread for better replacements :]

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notears wrote:
notears wrote:

yeah the mogul perk was a big mistake in hindsight... making a custom building from scratch is way harder than making a prop or material from scratch, and now the devs have to sleep in the bed they made... once they hire these new people, the mogul building should go faster but, their definably has to be a better replacement for mogul buildings so that this mistake never happens again... luckily there's a whole suggestion thread for better replacements :]

Well hindsight's always going to be 20/20. Having the Mogul perk was an interesting idea but setting it at $500 was probably too low all things considered.

Think about it this way: I don't know how many Moguls people actually paid for but let's say there were 100 of them. That means the Devs of this game became obligated to custom-make 100 different locations which is likely taking a very long time to produce.

Now had the Devs charged $2000 for them it'd be easy to assume there would've been far few purchasers of that Add-On; perhaps maybe only 25 people would have been willing to pay that price instead of 100. In one case you have 100 x $500 = $50,000... But in the other case you would have had 25 x $2000 which is also $50,000. The net effect is that they would have likely earned a similar amount of KS money but only have 1/4 the work to do. Sure you could point out that means only 1/4 the total number of people would have Mogul buildings. But right now the obligation to create 100 of them is likely causing the ENTIRE GAME to take longer to be ready than it otherwise would have and until the game launches technically NO ONE has access to their Mogul buildings.

The concept of the Mogul Add-on is something the Devs could actually offer post launch as well. There's nothing to say that they could have only done them pre-launch. Sure it might be easier to squeeze them on the maps while the game is still being developed but updating maps -after- launch is not impossible. I mention this because there was no incredible need to get them "all done" before launch. By self imposing that bottleneck on their efforts the Devs further complicated things for themselves during this critical period while they're simply trying to get ANY version of the game launched much less one with a bunch of unique Mogul buildings in place.

So in perfect 20/20 hindsight the Mogul Add-on should have cost more during KS and it should be offered as an option for players to purchase AFTER launch. Both of those changes would have eliminated the need for the Devs to do a huge amount of bottlenecked Mogul work prior to the game's launch.

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Even bumping it to $1000

Even bumping it to $1000 would have substantially cut down on the number of backers. The number of backers at each successive reward tier is not a linear decline. I made a chart. Like you said, that's hindsight. I don't think they thought as many people would be interested in donating quite so much. And really from a strictly investing standpoint it was a bad investment. You have a loosely knit group of people, not developers, with little to no experience, who are going to build one of the most complex and expensive types of games on the market. They've got passion, but what else? They've done alright so far, but again we only see that today.

Knowing what I know today I would have been all over Mogul. I'll have to content myself with a badge location.

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Hopefully the devs involved

Hopefully the devs involved will keep track of the actual cost (tool time and dev time and anything else that goes into it) when making the existing mogul buildings so that later they can be priced appropriately.

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just checked the kickstarter

just checked the kickstarter page... it's 90... there are 90 moguls... and since the ones above that say "+ all previous awards" that means 50 people who backed $750, 36 who backed $1000, 6 who have backed $1500, 12 who backed $3000, 2 who backed $5000, 6 who have pledged $7500 and 1 who has donated $10,000 all adding up to 201 buildings that they need to make... can they even fit that many mogul buildings in the game world? That's 201 buildings that they need to make from scratch!! So I think what they should do, is ask if people want to post pone their mogul buildings, or want to put them in future zones so that they can just add them in later... or else we are going to have a huge problem here!!

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I mean... the devs just have

I mean... the devs just have to be smarter about this if this game is going to last or even make it past launch!!

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I think I may have another

I think I may have another idea, could the devs maybe point to buildings that are already built and go "Alright... which one do you want? We can modify it afterwards, but you gotta pick one of these as a base for your mogul building" like have them choose from a list of premade buildings that they can add a number of stuff to.

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notears, Mogul was an add-on,

notears, Mogul was an add-on, not a tier, so it didn't fall under the "plus all lower tier rewards" thing. For example, I got Double Trouble ($1500) but no Mogul. You can climb down from the tree now; we're not that hosed.

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Lin Chiao Feng wrote:
Lin Chiao Feng wrote:

notears, Mogul was an add-on, not a tier, so it didn't fall under the "plus all lower tier rewards" thing. For example, I got Double Trouble ($1500) but no Mogul. You can climb down from the tree now; we're not that hosed.

To be honest I was wondering where notears was getting the "201 Moguls" number myself. I don't know if the actual number is something you'd rather not divulge at this time but either way I estimated that there were roughly 100 of them mostly based on various hints dropped over the years and just a "gut feeling" on the matter. If you could give us the exact number at some point it would certainly be a nice bit of trivia to know.

Hopefully I'm basically wrong about my suspicion that the $500 price point of the Mogul allowed many more people to get one than MWM originally expected. I can only imagine that if you have a whole bunch of them to do that it may have slightly overwhelmed your ability to get them all done before launch. In full disclosure (in case you weren't aware) I was one of the Moguls myself so if anything I contributed to the glut of Moguls you guys are having to worry about.

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Lin Chiao Feng wrote:
Lin Chiao Feng wrote:

notears, Mogul was an add-on, not a tier, so it didn't fall under the "plus all lower tier rewards" thing. For example, I got Double Trouble ($1500) but no Mogul. You can climb down from the tree now; we're not that hosed.

Oh thank god I was worried there for a second...

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by the way how many mogul's

by the way how many mogul's are there? for curiosities sake

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Lothic wrote:
Lothic wrote:

To be honest I was wondering where notears was getting the "201 Moguls" number myself.

I recognized the numbers because I just recently scraped the same numbers off our KS page.

Lothic wrote:

I don't know if the actual number is something you'd rather not divulge at this time but either way I estimated that there were roughly 100 of them mostly based on various hints dropped over the years and just a "gut feeling" on the matter. If you could give us the exact number at some point it would certainly be a nice bit of trivia to know.

That's Dr. Tyche's or Warcabbit's call. I lack the required need to know, though I suspect it'll come out later, closer to launch, when someone will ask for a gallery of the Moguls' buildings on the site.

Lothic wrote:

Hopefully I'm basically wrong about my suspicion that the $500 price point of the Mogul allowed many more people to get one than MWM originally expected.

I have no idea what we expected in 2013. In my personal opinion, the price point was too low at the very least, and at best we should have offered some more fine-grained steps at different price points, with caps on building complexity at each level. But that's all water under the bridge now.

Lothic wrote:

I can only imagine that if you have a whole bunch of them to do that it may have slightly overwhelmed your ability to get them all done before launch.

No idea. But bear in mind that the Kickstarter was long finished before we announced the current Fall 2018 launch date.

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Lin Chiao Feng wrote:
Lin Chiao Feng wrote:
Lothic wrote:

I can only imagine that if you have a whole bunch of them to do that it may have slightly overwhelmed your ability to get them all done before launch.

No idea. But bear in mind that the Kickstarter was long finished before we announced the current Fall 2018 launch date.

Right I realize you guys knew how many Moguls you had to do years ago. My point was that the overall number of Moguls you had to do might have single-handedly affected your plans for when you set your launch date in the first place. For instance it may have been possible you could have set the launch date for "Summer 2018" if you only had to do say half the number of Moguls you're actually on the hook for.

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I completely understand that

I completely understand that it's probably time/cost prohibitive. Honestly I wouldn't have minded if there was a note about the mogul buildings having to wait until another issue. Either way the most important thing is getting the game out and done right.

Still, I can hope.

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I'm a bit disappointed that I

I'm a bit disappointed that I won't be able to get a veterinary hospital. I probably couldn't afford it anyway, but a kitty can always dream ...!

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If it will help launch sooner

If it will help launch sooner, my building can be delayed with a skeleton structure in the lot, fences surrounding it with "Coming in (e.t.c.) from Morrison and O'Brian AE&G" until it's finished, at which time the fences come down and the skeleton is replaced by the actual structure. ^_^

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I don't know that if I had

I don't know that if I had even been around for the KS I would've done the mogul thing. I don't care about having my own building. But I know a museum was mentioned earlier, does that mean only that person can walk into the museum?

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For me what was enticing

For me what was enticing about the mogul perk wasn't so much to 'have my own building' as to help design a concept for an interesting building that I think would be fun to see become a part of the world in Titan city.

The building design I put forward was the Walter Scott Memorial in Edinburgh, a Gothic tower that's a really amazing structure. I just think it would be a great piece of environmental architecture to see in the game somewhere (and if I had a secret room to use as a lair for my SG - that's just a bonus.) I've also really enjoyed reading the concepts other people have put forward too. For me, what was a valuable about the mogul concept was the sharing of creativity to help make an interesting city.

If the logistics of implementing the mogul program were too complicated, then I would be supportive of holding off on it until after launch as well. However, I haven't heard any dev come forward and say that it is, in fact, too complicated to do before launch. I remain hopeful that the launch will happen in 2018 with the mogul buildings as a fully integrated part of the launch.

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Another thing to keep in mind

Another thing to keep in mind is that not all mogul buildings are slated for launch districts.


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I assumed 90 people got mogul

I assumed 90 people got mogul because 90 people got the $500 reward tier. This is not accurate. If I understand correctly you got your reward tier then had to pay the add-on cost. So you'd spend $505 to get your desktop backgrounds and a building. Perhaps someone can clarify. In which case the number of moguls could be substantially less or vastly more than that number. Based on my chart, there can't be more than 194 moguls, which is total KS funding (678,189) minus the total value of each reward tier (581,005) divided by the cost of mogul(500). (assuming all add-ons were mogul.)

Still even at 194 if each is as large as Lothic's Burj there are enough blocks in the starting city to accommodate. I know from the 3 that I know about that not all are quite so large. And as Tannim points out not all will be in starting zones. And some may not be above ground, someone may have requested their mogul to be a baroque subway station or cave of bats.

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I'm all confused...

I'm all confused...

I had thought Mogul was helping design a building to use as your base but re-looking at the Kickstarter it looks like it's just naming a skyscraper and getting the penthouse to use as a base.

The Key to Titan City pledge tier should be where one is getting to help design a building - Key to Titan City - Your character is famous throughout the city. Everyone knows your character. Billboards celebrate or condemn your exploits, regular news broadcasts will include your character. You will get an exclusive base location within a city building of your design. Your custom logo will be used on spotlights throughout the city to signal you for early access missions Additionally, the city has erected a statue in your honor, complete with history plaque + All previous rewards.

Mogul (naming) was $500, Key was $7,500...

So in talking about how much of a pledge and time it takes to do a custom building shouldn't it just be the Key to Titan City and above pledge tier you look at? That would look to put it at 7 customer buildings? (6 from Key and 1 from tier above - Sanctum Sanctorum)

Though there should maybe be a few more customer buildings 'cause I know couple people grabbed the customer building option when it was mistakenly listed at $75 - It sounded like 4 or 5 people grabbed this and "the powers that be" told at least a few of them they would be getting the Key to Titan City tier despite not paying full price... (I know since I was one of them though that *may* have gone by the wayside since I don't know if it's been followed up or not...)

So... May 12ish Key of City which theoretically should be helping design buildings... Moguls (the add on) is just about naming buildings?

Or... I'm confused?

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re-reading those that does

re-reading those that does seem to be a more accurate presentation of the tiers...case of mass hysteria/hypnosis? Is there a troller in the house? I'm surprised a dev didn't chime in with that...

edit for old jargon

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The Mogul reward is the add

The Mogul reward is the add on which allows you to help design a building. The survey that I received was for the "Mogul reward" and the survey included what type of building I would like to see, the part of the city where I would like to see the building, and a general description of the building. The response to the survey indicated it would be assigned to an artist who will work with me on developing the building.

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Tempest wrote:
Tempest wrote:

The Mogul reward is the add on which allows you to help design a building. The survey that I received was for the "Mogul reward" and the survey included what type of building I would like to see, the part of the city where I would like to see the building, and a general description of the building. The response to the survey indicated it would be assigned to an artist who will work with me on developing the building.

https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/missingworldsmedia/the-phoenix-project-city-of-titans?ref=user_menu

"Mogul - $500
Join the likes of Carnegie, Vanderbilt, and Hershey: have one of our glorious skyscrapers named after you (or as you choose, pending approval), and gain the building's penthouse as a unique living space of super base."

So ok, yes, it makes sense they would want some input from the person naming the building as to what type of building they are naming... But if they are actually designing buildings as to Mogul's requests well then they are wasting a lot of time that should be spent on Key to Titan City holders or the game . *shrug*

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*clings to the fragile hope

*clings to the fragile hope that there will be a veterinary hospital in an area analogous to Kings Row*

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Kaemgen wrote:
Kaemgen wrote:

So ok, yes, it makes sense they would want some input from the person naming the building as to what type of building they are naming... But if they are actually designing buildings as to Mogul's requests well then they are wasting a lot of time that should be spent on Key to Titan City holders or the game . *shrug*

Well first off there were only 7 "Key to Titan City" people in the game (6 at that level + plus the one guy who paid for the Sanctum Sanctorum) so I'm guessing they'll have plenty of time to cater to those 7 people as well as the rest of the game.

But to get back to considering the Moguls that's where a big chunk of time might be "hiding" as far as what the art Devs have been busy working on for the last few years. Tannim of course reminded us that not all the Moguls will have to be finished by launch time (because some of them are going to be placed in zones that won't be ready at launch) but that still leaves us to wonder exactly how many they are dealing with. Until the Devs decide to give us the precise number we are going to be left to speculate. I still suspect they got far more people to spend the $500 on a Mogul than they ever anticipated and they've been juggling the work load that represented ever since. It'll be fine if they can handle it but it'll be unfortunate if they can't.

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Lothic wrote:
Lothic wrote:

But to get back to considering the Moguls that's where a big chunk of time might be "hiding" as far as what the art Devs have been busy working on for the last few years. Tannim of course reminded us that not all the Moguls will have to be finished by launch time (because some of them are going to be placed in zones that won't be ready at launch) but that still leaves us to wonder exactly how many they are dealing with. Until the Devs decide to give us the precise number we are going to be left to speculate. I still suspect they got far more people to spend the $500 on a Mogul than they ever anticipated and they've been juggling the work load that represented ever since. It'll be fine if they can handle it but it'll be unfortunate if they can't.

But... but....

My main point is that, from reading the Kickstarter page Mogul description, the art team shouldn't really have to spend any time on Moguls. The description says Moguls get to name buildings, not have them specially designed.

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I still don't quite

I still don't quite understand this mogul thing. If they are choosing the name of the building, then the devs should already be working on buildings that the backers can name. Since this is too easy, im thinking the backers actually helped design the buildings in which case I am wondering, did the backers create blueprints for the devs to follow? If they are already making buildings, why does it take longer to make another one that someone else picked? How intricate are these mogul buildings? Do all mogul buildings require the inside to be created as well?

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Again, as per Kickstarter

Again, as per Kickstarter page...

Mogul Add On allows the naming of "our glorious skyscrapers" and the penthouse as a super group base or living quarters. It says nothing about the buyer helping to design either the building or the living space.

Key to Titan City tier level says "You will get an exclusive base location of your design."

So Moguls shouldn't be actually involved in any design process, no matter how many of them there are. It should only be Key to Titan City and above (and the lucky dogs / quickdraws who were told they'd get that level of rewards...) but since not even all of them are actually getting it I suspect only a small handful of "custom" buildings need be made...

Unless the powers that be got confused and are designing buildings for Moguls just 'cause they thought the term sounded like they should??

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The original plan was not to

The original plan was not to have Moguls involved in the design process. However, the person managing the KS Backers at the time misunderstood the writeup, and by the time any of us knew about it, was too late and they'd promised custom buildings to every Mogul. So, because they promised, we're aiming to deliver on what they promised.

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*captain picard facepalm*

*captain picard facepalm*

I'm at work so cant access images lol

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Kaemgen wrote:
Kaemgen wrote:

But... but....
My main point is that, from reading the Kickstarter page Mogul description, the art team shouldn't really have to spend any time on Moguls. The description says Moguls get to name buildings, not have them specially designed.

I guess I can see where the Mogul's description might have been misleading that way. I bought a Mogul and as far as I understood it I was able to "design" my building based on the description I gave when the Devs emailed me about it. As I've mentioned in other threads I asked for a slightly modified version of the Burj Khalifa. Ironically part of the reason I chose an existing building (that was relatively simple in its design) was that there are thousands of pics of it online so I assumed that would make the job of the art Devs easier to essentially "copy" it to the best of their ability.

Where I think the real problem has appeared is that a number of other people who bought Moguls asked for very detailed/intricate designs which I can only imagine multiplied the amount of work the Devs are now obligated to finish.

Doctor Tyche wrote:

The original plan was not to have Moguls involved in the design process. However, the person managing the KS Backers at the time misunderstood the writeup, and by the time any of us knew about it, was too late and they'd promised custom buildings to every Mogul. So, because they promised, we're aiming to deliver on what they promised.

This... more or less.

Actually I "understood" it to mean being able to get a "custom made building" at least as far back as when I bought it during the KS so if this was a "miscommunication" on the Devs' part it was one that was made practically the day the KS started. *shrugs*

CoH player from April 25, 2004 to November 30, 2012

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That's kinda frustrating. The

That's kinda frustrating. The devs are taking longer and struggling to catch up because of miscommunication? I get it if this was a fast food joint and you accidentally promised some fries with the meal, but a game that thousands of people are waiting for, maybe it would've been a better business decision to say that there was a misunderstanding and continue on with what your intent was.

I get it you morally wanted to do the right thing, but its setting you guys back a lot.

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Wolfgang8565 wrote:
Wolfgang8565 wrote:

That's kinda frustrating. The devs are taking longer and struggling to catch up because of miscommunication? I get it if this was a fast food joint and you accidentally promised some fries with the meal, but a game that thousands of people are waiting for, maybe it would've been a better business decision to say that there was a misunderstanding and continue on with what your intent was.

I get it you morally wanted to do the right thing, but its setting you guys back a lot.

And this, among other things, is why at the very least I'd like to know exactly how many Moguls there are "in the pipeline" so to speak. It's always better to discuss these things with actual numbers instead of ones we have to make up for ourselves.

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I mean it happens all the

I mean it happens all the time, just recently I got an email from the lottery announcing a new scratcher, and they sent another email shortly after apologizing saying someone was click happy and sent the email too soon.

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Lothic wrote:
Lothic wrote:

Wolfgang8565 wrote:
That's kinda frustrating. The devs are taking longer and struggling to catch up because of miscommunication? I get it if this was a fast food joint and you accidentally promised some fries with the meal, but a game that thousands of people are waiting for, maybe it would've been a better business decision to say that there was a misunderstanding and continue on with what your intent was.
I get it you morally wanted to do the right thing, but its setting you guys back a lot.
And this, among other things, is why at the very least I'd like to know exactly how many Moguls there are "in the pipeline" so to speak. It's always better to discuss these things with actual numbers instead of ones we have to make up for ourselves.

Just shy of 100

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Is there a facepalm where the

Is there a facepalm where the hand is so far into the head its sticking out the back?

..sigh..

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Doctor Tyche wrote:
Doctor Tyche wrote:

Lothic wrote:
Wolfgang8565 wrote:
That's kinda frustrating. The devs are taking longer and struggling to catch up because of miscommunication? I get it if this was a fast food joint and you accidentally promised some fries with the meal, but a game that thousands of people are waiting for, maybe it would've been a better business decision to say that there was a misunderstanding and continue on with what your intent was.
I get it you morally wanted to do the right thing, but its setting you guys back a lot.
And this, among other things, is why at the very least I'd like to know exactly how many Moguls there are "in the pipeline" so to speak. It's always better to discuss these things with actual numbers instead of ones we have to make up for ourselves.
Just shy of 100

Thank you. For what it's worth I guess my earlier working estimate of "100" was relatively good. This means if at least -some- are getting deferred to post-launch zones then you've probably got something like maybe 50 or 60 to do before launch.

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The UE4 devkit can be

The UE4 devkit can be downloaded and installed for free onto a computer with sufficient hardware. I can't say yet how long it takes to learn to build. But if all the Moguls and Keys got straight to working on it then:

  • MWM could focus on other issues
  • City of Titans would be a spectacular array of aborted art projects
  • Everyone would be too busy to fill up these threads

"The illusion which exalts us is dearer to us than ten thousand truths." - Pushkin
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Airhead wrote:
Airhead wrote:

The UE4 devkit can be downloaded and installed for free onto a computer with sufficient hardware. I can't say yet how long it takes to learn to build. But if all the Moguls and Keys got straight to working on it then:
MWM could focus on other issues
City of Titans would be a spectacular array of aborted art projects
Everyone would be too busy to fill up these threads

This might have been a nice idea to save MWM some time 3 or 4 years ago. But let's work with the numbers we now have to make some reasonable educated guesses.

Based on what Doctor Tyche and Tannim have both said in this thread there are perhaps 95 total Moguls in the game and knowing that at least "some" of them will be added post-launch that means they may need to finish anywhere from 40 to as many as 70 Moguls before launch. Hard to tell with this estimate but if they are planning to defer ANY of them until after launch it makes some sense they would defer at least a 1/3 to 1/2 of the overall total (otherwise why bother deferring any of them).

So let's take our worst case number and say the Devs are stuck with trying to get 70 of them done before launch. That is a big number but even if that's the case they've had now at least 2 or 3 solid YEARS to work on them so far and they still have the better part of a year before their "Fall 2018" launch estimate. I still think they might have sort of "shot themselves in the foot" by giving themselves that much up-front Mogul work to do but it's probably not a completely impossible task to get -everything- done by then.

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yeah, I mean.... they screwed

yeah, I mean.... they screwed up here but... well I'm glad they're being honest about this... and they didn't shoot themselves a big enough hole in their foot that all our money is going to be wasted on this especially with the second kickstarter coming along... it's just... if this happens again? I'm going to lose a lot of faith on this project...

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My last post was kidding

My last post was kidding (except for the third bullet) although aborted art projects could reflect an epic tear in space-time...

Doctor Tyche's post wasn't a surprise, this issue was raised and discussed on these boards soon after it popped up, back when folks were guessing the Mogul count in 2013 (search 'mogul'). On the plus side it probably doesn't hurt the creative processes to get extra input on buildings if most of us have been genre-savvy or at least sensible. Best of all, this reminds us to accept future decisions by MWM to cut approved scope to meet schedule or resources from time to time. "Think of the moguls!"

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As for the Burj Khalifa, I

As for the Burj Khalifa, I read somewhere that as many as a dozen Moguls chose that building as the model for their project. So the Devs may have less work to do (and be less behind) than some people fear. I'm going to presume the Devs have good project management skills and will be able to pull it all together nicely, before the sky falls in.

Be Well!
Fireheart

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Fireheart wrote:
Fireheart wrote:

I'm going to presume the Devs have good project management skills and will be able to pull it all together nicely, before the sky falls in.
Fireheart

This. I recall that they only announced the projected 2018 release date after their own estimates - presumably including the launch-zone moguls - for several months were that they could hold that date.

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Wolfgang8565 wrote:
Wolfgang8565 wrote:

*captain picard facepalm*

I'm at work so cant access images lol

Wolfgang8565 wrote:

Is there a facepalm where the hand is so far into the head its sticking out the back?

Personally, I think that this image is more appropriate to the situation.


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Doctor Tyche wrote:
Doctor Tyche wrote:

The original plan was not to have Moguls involved in the design process. However, the person managing the KS Backers at the time misunderstood the writeup, and by the time any of us knew about it, was too late and they'd promised custom buildings to every Mogul. So, because they promised, we're aiming to deliver on what they promised.

Well if that's the case has everyone that was promised a building been contacted already?

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I've been contacted. I'm

I've been contacted. I'm pretty flexible on the building, I just want a really boss neon sign on it. The sign might take some work, but the building can be a big rectangle for all I care.

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Radiac wrote:
Radiac wrote:

I've been contacted. I'm pretty flexible on the building, I just want a really boss neon sign on it. The sign might take some work, but the building can be a big rectangle for all I care.

A neon sign is trivial. I'm not an artist, and I could make it.

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