Discuss: Where We Stand - The Spandex

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Shadow Elusive
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Discuss: Where We Stand - The Spandex

Color, color, everywhere.

Read the update here

--------------------------

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Ysangard
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I like it so MUCH !!

I like it so MUCH !!
Great Job MWM.

And I think the names of the Paragons are (in the order) : Arrow Shade, Memory, Cambion, Anthem, Particle?, Vodnik and Overclock...(where is Codebreacker?)

EDIT names order : Arrow Shade - Memory - Cambion - Anthem - Codebreacker - Vodnik - Particle

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Ysangard wrote:
Ysangard wrote:

I like it so MUCH !!
Great Job MWM.
And I think the names of the Paragons are (in the order) : Arrow Shade, Memory, Cambion, Anthem, Particle?, Vodnik and Overlock...(where is Codebreacker?)

Overclock is the only one not present in that image (Design is not finalized totally yet), Particle is the last blue one and CodeBreaker is the one next to Anthem :)

Charles Logan
www.cloganart.com

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So many textures! So many

So many textures! So many patterns!

Foradain, Mage of Phoenix Rising.
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If you can't see an image I've posted, please let me know!

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Awesome and quite impressive.

Awesome and quite impressive. I am digging the direction.

Mewkychan
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Well, at least we're gonna

Well, at least we're gonna LOOK GREAT! :)

-- Mewkychan =^.^=m mew!

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My body is ready. Looking

My body is ready. Looking beautiful folks! More more more!

Formerly @Fireforged, member of In Hoc Signo Vinces
Characters: Fireforged, Shadowforged, Pyreforged, Grumpy Bear, Heal Machine, Stormalong, Kingdom Red 10-23, Jaster Mereel, Steam Rifle Scarlet, Nemesis Rector

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They are looking great!

They are looking great!

BTW, folks, if you like the art, why not drop by the Twitch stream and see Mr. Logan work on various commission pieces? https://www.twitch.tv/cloganart

(insert pithy comment here)

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I think I am in love with the

I think I am in love with the updated look for Anthem. She is by far my favorite of the bunch now. Cambion looks like he's been influenced by the art of Mike Mignola.


I like to take your ideas and supersize them. This isn't criticism, it is flattery. I come with nothing but good will and a spirit of team-building. If you take what I write any other way, that is probably just because I wasn't very clear.
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Looks great.

Looks great.

Crowd Control Enthusiast

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This was so exciting.

This was so exciting.

Spandex may have been the old stand by, but the modern military and athletes are constantly exploring the benefits of compression gear--from increasing endurance to reducing bleeding from injuries--and it looks about like like... spandex.

What the final art-style will be for CoT has been a concern for me because both Champions and DCUO left me pretty cold. Now, I understand that this isn't a reveal of final art style, but, after seeing the direction and the thinking that's implied by this update, I'm pretty confident I'm going to be thrilled.

Soooo exciting.

FIGHT EVIL! (or go cause trouble so the Heroes have something to do.)

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*Wipes tear off cheek* Our

*Wipes tear off cheek* Our baby growing up! Soon we be flying again!

Really glad and proud to see such thought and hard work going into City of Titans. One reason I put this project above the other successors. We aren't rebuilding, we are reimaging. Taking what worked and pushing it forward beyond what was expected. True Superhero style fall down come back better then ever.

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1.) Nothing goes as planned.
2.) If it goes as planned it's not good RP

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Still waiting for

Still waiting for confirmation on movable decals ;)

Spandex is looking good though :)

"A delayed game is eventually good, but a rushed game is forever bad"

Please have Scaling decals!

Avatar by MikeNovember

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Great update. The Paragons

Great update. The Paragons look awesome and those gifs at the very end, with the multi-material/texture costume options ... man I can't wait to start playing with the avatar builder. Also interested to see what the "rebranding" entails. Keep up the good work MWM!

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Excellent work guys. Can't

Excellent work guys. Can't wait to get my hands on the Avatar Builder. The look of this game appears as if it will be the standard bearer going forward.

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Nice spandex...but hopefully

Nice spandex...but hopefully we can also have the tried and true underwear on the outside look! :D

Freeze evil doer...I SAID FREEZE!! *fires freeze ray*

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I do like how the Paragons

I do like how the Paragons are looking. And as said previously, I'm interested in this re-branding effort.

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Neat.

Neat.

cloganart
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This is the mood behind the

This is the mood behind the art department.

Charles Logan
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Everything looks amazing.

Everything looks amazing. Waiting...

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OOOH, spandex. I look good

OOOH, spandex. I look good in spandex. Well, not me personally, but my avatars will look incredible.

Keep up the good work. My faith in the project has never faltered.

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Mmmmm, spandex is okay, but

Mmmmm, spandex is okay, but most of my characters wear Clothes! Well, or armor. Mmm, and that one guy that wears just a sorta kilt, because of all the Fur! Or, that gal that's made of metal...

I guess spandex is okay, but I'm gonna need more.

Be Well!
Fireheart

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It's a certainty - several of

It's a certainty - several of the characters shown are not spandexy (?). New word.

(insert pithy comment here)

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This is amazing:https:/

This is amazing:
https://cityoftitans.com/sites/default/files/Paragon%20Concept.jpg

The 2d art is something incredible really. But I see something that worries me, the spandex in 3d is different compared to the one suggested by the 2d artist, it loses art. The lines are not at the same places, for example the lines that should be around the muscles of the body following the 2d art (TOP for example) are cutting those same muscles in the 3d art etc. changing the style and beauty. Because that's a kind of line that want to make some specific muscles more visible instead of cutting them in half.

I found visibly wrong the Top, belt, stomach, legs, neck lines for example in the TRAINEE here (too much):
https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/missingworldsmedia/the-phoenix-project-city-of-titans/posts/1838408

Tell the 3d artist to use more accuracy when following the 2d one, it's important because it loses style, quality, beauty by putting the lines so causally around.

Also pay attention to the orangutan-body effect, where arms and legs have the same length. Even in Dragon Age 1 there was this issue, and your 3rd bodies suffer that too, but I guess we can customize those, still the pre-made body is important for all the guys who won't lose time changing length, it becomes the "normal-body" and therefore most common one in the world (and npc too, usually).

By watching this I see an incredible comics-art ability in the 2d artist, the 3d one instead may be very good with 3d but not with bodies or art it self, and that risks to lower the comics-feeling and general quality on release (even with realistic style). My suggestion is to "use" the 2d artist to check/"proof-read" the final results, the work of the 3d builder and be very "evil" on spotting all the little differences, since I think the 3d builder seems great at his work but he needs the comics-art point of view of the 2d one. They need to be a squad till the final steps.

By the way, this is amazing too:
https://ksr-ugc.imgix.net/assets/016/073/249/7db5467773f23138ff045170bbf0c95e_original.gif?w=639&fit=max&v=1490916573&auto=format&gif-q=50&q=92&s=c641e458f578fccf848ec0b1b6c6cfae

And I use spandex-based chars usually (Wonder-man like tanks), therefore this update is great for me.

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Nice update guys. Inspired me

Nice update guys. Inspired me to get back in the tights.

I guess I and the game are not ready yet.
P.S I'm not really fat

I accidently ate a bowl of radioactive soup....ok I guess that makes me a Soup-er Hero

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Really nice resolution on

Really nice resolution on those textures! Even if not always apparent in game it will make for some fantastic close-up stills.

"The illusion which exalts us is dearer to us than ten thousand truths." - Pushkin
"One piece of flair is all I need." - Sister Silicon

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Wow. Just wow. Can't decide

Wow. Just wow. Can't decide which I like better: the concept art of the Paragons or the actual in-game model textures. I think you've done exactly what you set out to do by creating something that covers the entire evolution of the superhero costume.

I'm with Empyrean on having had final art style as somewhat of a concern throughout this project. Not doubting MWM's abilities, but just due to lack of information. Now we know how cool the costumes will be -- as well as the city itself, if the glimpses we've seen are anything to go by. This leaves only faces as the last significant -- but possibly the most difficult -- variable. If you guys can pull off that last piece with the same aplomb, we should be more than ok.

Spurn all ye kindle.

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Loving it.

Loving it.

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Every update is a little more

Every update is a little more polished than the last. Every update gives me more confidence that CoT will be worth the wait.

I get the feeling this game is going to be something quite special.

Keep it up!

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RottenLuck wrote:
RottenLuck wrote:

*Wipes tear off cheek* Our baby growing up! Soon we be flying again!
Really glad and proud to see such thought and hard work going into City of Titans. One reason I put this project above the other successors. We aren't rebuilding, we are reimaging. Taking what worked and pushing it forward beyond what was expected. True Superhero style fall down come back better then ever.

I agree 100%.
each and every update is more dramatic than the last.

MWM...thank you! you always exceed expectations!

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Hijinx on my phone and the

Hijinx on my phone and the Paragons on my PC.

My desktops are happy now.

Spurn all ye kindle.

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This was a fun update! It's

This was a fun update! It's cool to see where the art direction is going!

Art Team

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Ohh, nice update.

Ohh, nice update.

I have to concur with others. The rate and quality of updates here gives me the most hope for CoT coming out on top of the others.

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Great job!

Great job!
Getting more excited with each update!

Will the shininess be variable or will it just be a function of what material we choose?

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Rigel wrote:
Rigel wrote:

Great job!
Getting more excited with each update!
Will the shininess be variable or will it just be a function of what material we choose?

THAT is a very good question. Ability to control "sheen" (not Charlie, noone can control him) can lead to a lot of creativity--if possible and allowed.

FIGHT EVIL! (or go cause trouble so the Heroes have something to do.)

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(No subject)

(insert pithy comment here)

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Empyrean wrote:
Empyrean wrote:

Rigel wrote:
Great job!
Getting more excited with each update!
Will the shininess be variable or will it just be a function of what material we choose?
THAT is a very good question. Ability to control "sheen" (not Charlie, noone can control him) can lead to a lot of creativity--if possible and allowed.

So I guess 100% "sheen" would equal WINNING!!! ;)

But to be serious for a moment having the ability to manually adjust the level of "sheen" on any costume item would be very useful. Case in point there were a handful of items back in CoH that were specifically hard-wired as being "shiny" versions of things. The problem was there were only a few items like this so it was pretty hard trying to get those shiny items to match up against anything else that was not shiny.

CoH player from April 25, 2004 to November 30, 2012

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Lothic wrote:
Lothic wrote:

Empyrean wrote:
Rigel wrote:
Great job!
Getting more excited with each update!
Will the shininess be variable or will it just be a function of what material we choose?
THAT is a very good question. Ability to control "sheen" (not Charlie, noone can control him) can lead to a lot of creativity--if possible and allowed.
So I guess 100% "sheen" would equal WINNING!!! ;)
But to be serious for a moment having the ability to manually adjust the level of "sheen" on any costume item would be very useful. Case in point there were a handful of items back in CoH that were specifically hard-wired as being "shiny" versions of things. The problem was there were only a few items like this so it was pretty hard trying to get those shiny items to match up against anything else that was not shiny.

Technical Director

Read enough Facebook and you have to make Sanity Checks. I guess FB is the Great Old One of the interent these days... - Beamrider

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Thing I especially appreciate

Thing I especially appreciate, even if expected by now, is that the color of the lining is also customizable. :)

" We are also giving the City of Titans brand a makeover so don’t be alarmed by the upcoming changes here and there."

Annnnd the intriguing ending to the update. XD

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The not matching up with

The not matching up with other things was one the reasons I asked about that few years. Yes It was hard when the different textures also affected the base colors.

Sometime you could get match by selecting one of the color presets that was off by one or two shades. Other times it was impossible .

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Godling wrote:
Godling wrote:

The not matching up with other things was one the reasons I asked about that few years. Yes It was hard when the different textures also affected the base colors.
Sometime you could get match by selecting one of the color presets that was off by one or two shades. Other times it was impossible .

That's a really good point. I remember that too.

If I recall, the devs have stated that the Unreal 4 engine uses materials. I suspect that each material has established light-affecting characteristics. So if your spandex is all the same material it should all look the same, no matter the texture. And I would expect that if you put the same pantone color on rubber spandex, homespun wool, and arcane silk each should look a little bit different.

As a result, I wonder if they're going to give us some different material suggestions for the same costume pieces. Let me use Anthem's Manica+Galerus as an example. It appears to be steel with a gold color. The same 3D mesh could be made of High-tech composide with a gold color and it would look complerely different. Likewise if it was gold-colored leather, or gold-colored chitin. So with a single 3D mesh, we could make a number of different costume items just by changing the material. Then you could make sure that your steampunk iron gauntlets match your steampunk iron boots and your steampunk iron facemask.


I like to take your ideas and supersize them. This isn't criticism, it is flattery. I come with nothing but good will and a spirit of team-building. If you take what I write any other way, that is probably just because I wasn't very clear.
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You're certainly my

You're certainly my huckleberry tonight!

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Huckleberry wrote:
Huckleberry wrote:

As a result, I wonder if they're going to give us some different material suggestions for the same costume pieces. Let me use Anthem's Manica+Galerus as an example. It appears to be steel with a gold color. The same 3D mesh could be made of High-tech composide with a gold color and it would look complerely different. Likewise if it was gold-colored leather, or gold-colored chitin. So with a single 3D mesh, we could make a number of different costume items just by changing the material. Then you could make sure that your steampunk iron gauntlets match your steampunk iron boots and your steampunk iron facemask.

What if I don't like the Steampunk boots? Can I mix the Steampunk mask and gloves with Dieselpunk boots, make them all Iron, and have them go together well? Or is the Dieselpunk 'iron' going to have different characteristics than Steampunk 'iron'?

Be Well!
Fireheart

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My personal favorite is a 10

My personal favorite is a 10.5% aluminium bronze. ^_^

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Yeah, a previous update on

Yeah, a previous update on the costume creator demonstrated Huckleberry's point. You can see where they change the material and the resultant effect on reflection/glare etc.

Spurn all ye kindle.

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Fireheart wrote:
Fireheart wrote:

What if I don't like the Steampunk boots? Can I mix the Steampunk mask and gloves with Dieselpunk boots, make them all Iron, and have them go together well? Or is the Dieselpunk 'iron' going to have different characteristics than Steampunk 'iron'?
Be Well!
Fireheart

If we did some secondary version of Iron, say 'oiled iron' and 'hammered iron' for diesel and steam, then they'd be different materials, and selectable. If we just have one iron, it's just one iron, rather than, say, copper, and selectable.

Does that make sense? So basically, if we HAD different versions of a material, you could choose it anyhow.

Project Lead

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warcabbit wrote:
warcabbit wrote:

You're certainly my huckleberry tonight!

Did you know where that term came from? In the days of chivalry, when a lady chose her champion, she would do so with a garland of whortleberry, a.k.a. huckleberry.

Thus the term "I'll be your huckleberry"! cool huh? I brought this up because of the recent discussion about name origins in the Archetypes thread. I love learning the lore behind strange names and terms and I hope we have some interesting ones to play with in CoT.


I like to take your ideas and supersize them. This isn't criticism, it is flattery. I come with nothing but good will and a spirit of team-building. If you take what I write any other way, that is probably just because I wasn't very clear.
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Huckleberry wrote:
Huckleberry wrote:

Did you know where that term came from? In the days of chivalry, when a lady chose her champion, she would do so with a garland of whortleberry, a.k.a. huckleberry.
Thus the term "I'll be your huckleberry"! cool huh? I brought this up because of the recent discussion about name origins in the Archetypes thread. I love learning the lore behind strange names and terms and I hope we have some interesting ones to play with in CoT.

Actually, sir... I believe it came from Doc Holliday in the film Tombstone.

I keed. In all seriousness, great movie and I couldn't resist.

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I should point out, our use

I should point out, our use of materials in this way, was specifically and explicitly designed to counter the 'is shiny' issues of the old chargen.
We know what you want cause we _are_ you. We may not always agree or be able to do it, but by gum, we ran into the same frustrations you did most of the time, and we're doing our very best to make sure it doesn't happen this time.

instead you get all new frustrations that we can't currently predict.

Project Lead

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I believe the quote from

I believe the quote from Tombstone should be "I'll be your hucklebearer." A huckle was a term for the handles on a coffin, so he essentially is saying "I'll be your pallbearer" (in modern terms), or in other words "I'll be happy to put you under ground." Either his accent in the movie obscured the word a fair bit or the writer and director got it wrong - most likely the first.

(insert pithy comment here)

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warcabbit wrote:
warcabbit wrote:

Instead you get all new frustrations that we can't currently predict.

So looking forward to it! *grin*

Be Well!
Fireheart

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Spandex Concepts to Model:

Spandex Concepts to Model:

There is a variation / discrepancy between the concept artwork and the model renders on the Glacier / Trainee designs. The line which crosses the pectoral muscle towards the neckline is more direct, rather than arched. I put it to you the line should be more arched / higher suggesting a heavier and bulkier chest.

In fact, I would say that is a (minor) improvement that could be made to all the costume lines - be aware that there is muscle depth / height involved. Consider the models side on / from all angles, beyond face on to see if the costumes need tweaking.

That said, I really like the designs you have come up with. :)

-- Tath.

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warcabbit wrote:
warcabbit wrote:

I should point out, our use of materials in this way, was specifically and explicitly designed to counter the 'is shiny' issues of the old chargen.
We know what you want cause we _are_ you. We may not always agree or be able to do it, but by gum, we ran into the same frustrations you did most of the time, and we're doing our very best to make sure it doesn't happen this time.
instead you get all new frustrations that we can't currently predict.

I am framing this. It's so descriptive of the "MWM advantage" that led to my support of the entire effort.

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What kind of materials are

What kind of materials are planned anyway? I'm hoping the buck doesn't stop with "fabric spandex leather" but also includes latex for example.

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Khrome wrote:
Khrome wrote:

What kind of materials are planned anyway? I'm hoping the buck doesn't stop with "fabric spandex leather" but also includes latex for example.

Fighting in latex sounds... sweaty. And slippery. And squeaky.

And it could lead to decreased enjoyment of combat due to reduced sensation.

But on the upshot, it would protect you from combatively transmitted diseases, so... there's that.

FIGHT EVIL! (or go cause trouble so the Heroes have something to do.)

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Empyrean wrote:
Empyrean wrote:

Fighting in latex sounds... sweaty. And slippery. And squeaky.
And it could lead to decreased enjoyment of combat due to reduced sensation.
But on the upshot, it would protect you from combatively transmitted diseases, so... there's that.

If we collectively don't seem to have any problem with comic book superheroes fighting crime in sky-high stiletto heels why should we worry if their outfits are made of latex? ;)

P.S. Just to be clear I am by no means arguing AGAINST having stiletto heels and/or latex clothing in CoT. I'm just pointing out that while those things would likely be absolutely impractical for superheroes "in real life" I'm all for having as many options as possible for CoT regardless of silly things like physics or practicality.

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Lothic wrote:
Lothic wrote:

P.S. Just to be clear I am by no means arguing AGAINST having stiletto heels and/or latex clothing in CoT. I'm just pointing out that while those things would likely be absolutely impractical for superheroes "in real life" I'm all for having as many options as possible for CoT regardless of silly things like physics or practicality.

Absolutely agreed--I just couldn't help making the joke :P.

Though the thought of coming home after a long day of crime-fighting wearing that outfit and those heels?

Oh the sweat and barking dogs. Now THAT'S a tough hero!

FIGHT EVIL! (or go cause trouble so the Heroes have something to do.)

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Doctor: "Sorry Son, you've

Doctor: "Sorry Son, you've got a CTD. Apply this cream on that rash everyday for the next week and it should go away. If not come back and we'll set you up with a stronger medication."
Hero: "Damn it! That's the last time I use a cheap pair of Latex pants!"
Doctor" "Spartan's are the best son, everyone knows that."

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There's gotta be a good joke

There's gotta be a good joke about a costume that is ribbed...

Ummm... uh?

Hmmm...

By the way, now there HAS to be a Spartan Latex Costume dispenser in a bathroom in the game.

H A S to be.

We can't have our heroes out there having unprotected combat and getting CTD's!

FIGHT EVIL! (or go cause trouble so the Heroes have something to do.)

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Spartan's Emergency Costume

Spartan's Emergency Costume Dispenser

1: Smooth and Sleek - 100 IGC
2: New: Ribbed (for that improved grip!) - 150 IGC

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T for Teen, guys. Not HT.

T for Teen, guys.

Not HT.

Has anyone seen my mind? It was right here...

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Empyrean wrote:
Empyrean wrote:

Absolutely agreed--I just couldn't help making the joke :P.
Though the thought of coming home after a long day of crime-fighting wearing that outfit and those heels?
Oh the sweat and barking dogs. Now THAT'S a tough hero!

The best part of the genre is that we can dispense with most things that actual people may need to contend with, because...flying, bolts of fire, arresting people by stabbing them with a sword, etc, etc.

(insert pithy comment here)

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Lin Chiao Feng wrote:
Lin Chiao Feng wrote:

T for Teen, guys.
Not HT.

Depends on how it's handled. Even Sponge Bob had subtle adult jokes for the grownups watching. If we come right out and make it all obvious and crude, well, of course not. Most people who want latex for costumes ain't thinkin T for Teens. Just sayin.

But anyway, I'm not pushing for adult content or adult jokes in CoT. I'm glad that's not what the game is about. I just think that one joke about latex costumes is funny, that's all.

FIGHT EVIL! (or go cause trouble so the Heroes have something to do.)

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I could of sworn my last

I could of sworn my last comment was over this post by you guys? Ah well.... I don't know what happened but I digress.. I know CoX is so old at this point, but I hope you include a torch hold emote at launch. For it would be the first screenshot I would take at launch day, or even Alpha launch day for that matter. I have much pride in this team and you have yet to let me down after all these years.

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Brutum wrote:
Brutum wrote:

I could of sworn my last comment was over this post by you guys? Ah well.... I don't know what happened but I digress.. I know CoX is so old at this point, but I hope you include a torch hold emote at launch. For it would be the first screenshot I would take at launch day, or even Alpha launch day for that matter. I have much pride in this team and you have yet to let me down after all these years.

I am going to go out on a limb here and say you aren't going to be disappointed with regard to that particular emote.

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I truly hope my friend. I

I truly hope my friend. I have much faith in this team, but I can do nothing but hope in them at this point as I have for years. None the less, I am sure you will make me proud, yes Tyche and CoT team? Yes... I am sure.

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Dark Ether wrote:
Dark Ether wrote:

The best part of the genre is that we can dispense with most things that actual people may need to contend with, because...flying, bolts of fire, arresting people by stabbing them with a sword, etc, etc.

Not only will the genre allow for practically anything but it even allows players the choice whether they even want to rationalize things or not.

For example I usually only put stiletto heels on characters who Hovered/Flew most of the time or who were perhaps super high-tech robots made of extra strong materials that could handle the ankle-breaking stresses without problems. Now if someone else wants their characters to wear stiletto heels without "explaining" how it works that's totally up to them and I don't have any issue with it. I just personally get more entertainment value from a game by nit-picking the details. ;)

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I see that Shiny costumes has

I see that Shiny costumes has come up. Back when COX came out my GPU couldn't handle reflective (pseudo-reflective) textures properly. (I think I started playing with a nvidia 6800GS) so certain shiny items looked massivly different on my PC than others. It also resulted in some mature additions to a certain female top IIRC. Hopefully that wont be an issue in this game, I think the graphics pipeline architecture is a bit more evolved than that at this point. The "shiny spandex" latex costumes reminded me of it, is why I brought it up.

Welcome back to the forums Rocket Cat.

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Grimfox wrote:
Grimfox wrote:

I see that Shiny costumes has come up. Back when COX came out my GPU couldn't handle reflective (pseudo-reflective) textures properly. (I think I started playing with a nvidia 6800GS) so certain shiny items looked massivly different on my PC than others. It also resulted in some mature additions to a certain female top IIRC. Hopefully that wont be an issue in this game, I think the graphics pipeline architecture is a bit more evolved than that at this point. The "shiny spandex" latex costumes reminded me of it, is why I brought it up.
Welcome back to the forums Rocket Cat.

I'll assume when you say "mature additions to a certain female top" you meant the unavoidably obvious bumpy-bits otherwise referred to by a word that starts with an "n" and ends in "ipples". Turns out the Grand Nipple Nerf was among one of CoH's first noteworthy (controversial?) nerfs that happened about a week after the game launched.

While I agree that texture processing has advanced quite a bit in the last 12+ years it does leave us to wonder if certain textures might end up being more or less translucent (and therefore more or less revealing) than others. I would think in simple terms of realism there would have to be certain clothing textures that would allow for visible nipple bumps for both males and females. The question of course is whether MWM would be willing to pursue that degree of realism given how decisively visible nipples (and even nipple bumpage) were nerfed more or less completely in CoH.

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That's a tricky question.

That's a tricky question. City of Titans obviously wants a big tent that every type of superhero fan can party under, which means catering to Adam West Spandex Batman, Tim Burton Gothic Batman, Paul Dini Art Deco Batman, Christopher Nolan Cyberpunk Batman, and even Zack Snyder Hulkbuster Batman. But how does MWM accomodate Joel Schumacher Nipple Suit Batman and keep a T for Teen rating?

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SisterSilicon wrote:
SisterSilicon wrote:

That's a tricky question. City of Titans obviously wants a big tent that every type of superhero fan can party under, which means catering to Adam West Spandex Batman, Tim Burton Gothic Batman, Paul Dini Art Deco Batman, Christopher Nolan Cyberpunk Batman, and even Zack Snyder Hulkbuster Batman. But how does MWM accomodate Joel Schumacher Nipple Suit Batman and keep a T for Teen rating?

Frankly if we can't have real/natural nip-bumps while wearing tight spandex/latex type textures I sure as heck wouldn't want any fake rubber Schumacher-esque nips either.

I'm expecting to tolerate having to live with Barbie-like nipless female character models in CoT only because I'm assuming we're going to get stuck with that by default to preserve the "T for Teen" rating. Despite that my pipe-dream ideal is still going to be as long as they made it so that you could never SEE the nips directly under semi-translucent materials we should still be able to have a detectable amount of 3D nip-bumpage from underneath certain kinds of tight materials.

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Couldn't they just have an

Couldn't they just have an button under Options / Settings to enable or disable nipple bumps? Boom, problem solved.

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Speaking T for Teen, is there

Speaking of T for Teen, is there going to a Profanity Filter? And if so, a way to turn it the **** off?

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Cobalt Azurean wrote:
Cobalt Azurean wrote:

Speaking of T for Teen, is there going to a Profanity Filter? And if so, a way to turn it the **** off?

Yes and yes. It's been working on the forums here quite well. Those nice, polite posts I seem to make? Well...

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avelworldcreator wrote:
avelworldcreator wrote:

Cobalt Azurean wrote:
Speaking of T for Teen, is there going to a Profanity Filter? And if so, a way to turn it the **** off?
Yes and yes. It's been working on the forums here quite well. Those nice, polite posts I seem to make? Well...

Edit: nope, filter no work

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Lothic wrote:
Lothic wrote:

SisterSilicon wrote:
That's a tricky question. City of Titans obviously wants a big tent that every type of superhero fan can party under, which means catering to Adam West Spandex Batman, Tim Burton Gothic Batman, Paul Dini Art Deco Batman, Christopher Nolan Cyberpunk Batman, and even Zack Snyder Hulkbuster Batman. But how does MWM accomodate Joel Schumacher Nipple Suit Batman and keep a T for Teen rating?
Frankly if we can't have real/natural nip-bumps while wearing tight spandex/latex type textures I sure as heck wouldn't want any fake rubber Schumacher-esque nips either.
I'm expecting to tolerate having to live with Barbie-like nipless female character models in CoT only because I'm assuming we're going to get stuck with that by default to preserve the "T for Teen" rating. Despite that my pipe-dream ideal is still going to be as long as they made it so that you could never SEE the nips directly under semi-translucent materials we should still be able to have a detectable amount of 3D nip-bumpage from underneath certain kinds of tight materials.

Another one for the cash shop. Only see it on your home computer. Makes those YouTube game play videos really popular!
MWM is gonna be so rich off of guys like me.

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Cobalt Azurean wrote:
Cobalt Azurean wrote:

Couldn't they just have an button under Options / Settings to enable or disable nipple bumps? Boom, problem solved.

Yes they could and it probably wouldn't even be that hard to implement in the grand scheme of things. The question, as always, is whether it'd be something MWM would WANT to implement. If there's truly a legitimate concern as to whether something like this could jeopardize the "T for Teen" rating of the game then the Devs won't give us such a toggle button even if it only took 5 minutes to create. *shrugs*

Cyclops wrote:

Another one for the cash shop. Only see it on your home computer. Makes those YouTube game play videos really popular! MWM is gonna be so rich off of guys like me.

Making nipple bumpage be something that you would first have to globally unlock via a cash store purchase before you could see it on anyone on your client might help as far as the game's rating goes. Make it something like $10 - if you don't want to see it anywhere on anyone then you don't have to pay for it.

But even if the game worked like that I think I'd still want a bumpage toggle button for each costume slot like Cobalt Azurean implied even AFTER I had unlocked it in the cash store. The reason is simple - character costume customization. For example I might want to see nipple bumpage on one of my characters if she's wearing a tight spandex leotard but I probably would NOT want to see it if she's wearing a tactical bulletproof vest. Having more options is always better than less options.

A nipple bumpage toggle button for each costume slot would be the ideal solution, even if it first required a global unlock like you suggested.

CoH player from April 25, 2004 to November 30, 2012

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Oh my heaven's above, no.

Oh my heaven's above, no. Don't turn MWM into a pay-for-prurience business. If you guys want nipple bumps, make an aftermarket mod and sell it yourselves, or find someone who will. I don't want nipple bumps on men or on women. and before you tell me that they're natural, they're not! Erect nipples are not a common thing unless its really cold, or the woman has had a very poor boob job; so don't use that argument to justify why you want them.
I'm all for jiggle, as long as it is the flesh and not the rigid armor that jiggles, but erect nipples is just too much.


I like to take your ideas and supersize them. This isn't criticism, it is flattery. I come with nothing but good will and a spirit of team-building. If you take what I write any other way, that is probably just because I wasn't very clear.
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Sorry for the late post on

Sorry for the late post on this.

Tath wrote:

Spandex Concepts to Model:
There is a variation / discrepancy between the concept artwork and the model renders on the Glacier / Trainee designs. The line which crosses the pectoral muscle towards the neckline is more direct, rather than arched. I put it to you the line should be more arched / higher suggesting a heavier and bulkier chest.
In fact, I would say that is a (minor) improvement that could be made to all the costume lines - be aware that there is muscle depth / height involved. Consider the models side on / from all angles, beyond face on to see if the costumes need tweaking.
That said, I really like the designs you have come up with. :)
-- Tath.

I really hadn't noticed the pec's as much as the waists. The trainee has the color band above the waist in the 2D and at the hip in the 3D. And the glacier went from having an ab-covering panel to wearing overalls or hip waders, which is not a flattering look.

I agree a little more faith to the 2D artist's work would be better.


I like to take your ideas and supersize them. This isn't criticism, it is flattery. I come with nothing but good will and a spirit of team-building. If you take what I write any other way, that is probably just because I wasn't very clear.
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cloganart wrote:
cloganart wrote:

Overclock is the only one not present in that image (Design is not finalized totally yet), Particle is the last blue one and CodeBreaker is the one next to Anthem :)

I can't wait to see overclock. He's so purely good, and kind of innocently lovably naive, that I think his look would be far from the brooding darkness of some of the others.

Ahhhh triple post. so sorry.


I like to take your ideas and supersize them. This isn't criticism, it is flattery. I come with nothing but good will and a spirit of team-building. If you take what I write any other way, that is probably just because I wasn't very clear.
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Huckleberry wrote:
Huckleberry wrote:

If you guys want nipple bumps, make an aftermarket mod and sell it yourselves, or find someone who will.

Oh I have no doubt that if CoT allows for the same kind of client-side mods that CoH did that someone, somewhere will do this if MWM doesn't. Ironically as I mentioned before the Devs of CoH tacitly tried to provide built-in nipple bumpage to their own game 13 years ago before they sadly caved to the pressure of a few strident voices about a week after launch. I was just hoping that perhaps in some decade some game will actually "grow a pair" and not bow to the vaguely defined public opposition over this.

Huckleberry wrote:

I don't want nipple bumps on men or on women. and before you tell me that they're natural, they're not! Erect nipples are not a common thing unless its really cold, or the woman has had a very poor boob job; so don't use that argument to justify why you want them.
I'm all for jiggle, as long as it is the flesh and not the rigid armor that jiggles, but erect nipples is just too much.

Your opinion on the matter is duly noted. I agreed with another poster's compromise implementation where people like you would not have to be "outraged" over this issue if you didn't want to see it in your game and yet you still saw fit to assume your position on this matter was more significant regardless.

Not to get too graphic about it (no pun intended) but A) I never used the word "erect" in relation to this discussion; that appears to be a word you're using to over-sensationalize this. You do realize nipple bumps can be visible under certain clothing scenarios without them needing to be "erect" - they just need to be there in the first place. And B) I've personally worn quite a few different types of materials over my own nipples over the years and all I can tell you is they are noticeably visible under many of those materials/textures regardless of temperature, regardless of "erectness" and without a very poor boob job. I don't know what your metric is for judging how "common" the phenomena is but the fact that it happens AT ALL under ANY scenario is enough for me for it to be a legitimate option.

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Nope. Definitely not what I

Nope. Definitely not what I was talking about. I wasn't one of the first few through the door so I can't recall there being a nipple bump. But there was and issue where certain dark colored tops with the shiney spandex texture would appear to have a dark circle showing through the top where the nipples would be. I truly believe this was an issue in the graphics pipeline for cards that couldn't deal with the texture properly. My point, I guess, was to emphasize that care should be taken to make sure things render the same on older hardware and newer hardware. And then I went on to state that it probably wasn't an issue given how rendering has changed in the past decade. My goal was definitely not to turn this into a yea/nea nipple thread. There are two other perfectly good threads for that.

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Grimfox wrote:
Grimfox wrote:

Nope. Definitely not what I was talking about. I wasn't one of the first few through the door so I can't recall there being a nipple bump. But there was and issue where certain dark colored tops with the shiney spandex texture would appear to have a dark circle showing through the top where the nipples would be. I truly believe this was an issue in the graphics pipeline for cards that couldn't deal with the texture properly. My point, I guess, was to emphasize that care should be taken to make sure things render the same on older hardware and newer hardware. And then I went on to state that it probably wasn't an issue given how rendering has changed in the past decade

There was in fact a defacto 3D "nipple bump" in the polygons of the female model that was "shaved down" during the Grand Nipple Nerfing of CoH. This was a separate issue from what you're talking about because as far as I recall it didn't involve low vs. high end video card processing. It was universally visible to enough people that the Devs practically applied a level of top priority hotfix urgency to get rid of it ASAP once they were made aware of it.

Grimfox wrote:

My goal was definitely not to turn this into a yea/nea nipple thread. There are two other perfectly good threads for that.

Just to be a tiny bit hyper-picky one of those "other threads" mainly dealt with the question of breast jiggle and other started off with the hope that CoT breasts would be designed better than the way they were implemented in CO. At best the topic of visible nipples and/or nipple bumps were tangential in both of those threads. When talking about texturing and potential levels of transparency this seems as good a thread as any to explore what might be seen of the character models UNDER those textures.

CoH player from April 25, 2004 to November 30, 2012

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Grimfox wrote:
Grimfox wrote:

My goal was definitely not to turn this into a yea/nea nipple thread.

When in Rome...

In all seriousness though, as with most things in life, I believe in having options. And if it's made to be an toggle-able option within the Settings client-side, then so much the better because it'll be the player's choice and won't affect anyone else. I'm not saying that I'll have it enabled and that's why I may appear to be game for it, but as stated previously, with a game that should tout it's merits in regards to personal customization, which is really just a way of saying there's a metric poo-ton of options, then I'm for it.

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Cobalt Azurean wrote:
Cobalt Azurean wrote:

Grimfox wrote:
My goal was definitely not to turn this into a yea/nea nipple thread.
When in Rome...
In all seriousness though, as with most things in life, I believe in having options. And if it's made to be an toggle-able option within the Settings client-side, then so much the better because it'll be the player's choice and won't affect anyone else. I'm not saying that I'll have it enabled and that's why I may appear to be game for it, but as stated previously, with a game that should tout it's merits in regards to personal customization, which is really just a way of saying there's a metric poo-ton of options, then I'm for it.

To paraphrase a relevant historical quote, "I may not like all your choices of client-side only options which wouldn't affect anyone else regardless, but I'll argue non-stop for your rights to have them!" Frankly players who arbitrarily take a stand against pushing back the ever-receding limits on personal character customization options in a game like this have always baffled me to some degree. *shrugs*

CoH player from April 25, 2004 to November 30, 2012

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I would rather pay MWM for a

I would rather pay MWM for a nipple bump than leave it up to modders. Every bit of cash that goes to the game is gold as far as I'm concerned.
cash for jiggle, cash for bumps. it is an elective, and those easily offended will never see it. '

we already have cash for costumes and some of those will be on the suggestive side. Might as well have everything else.
This is just supporting the game.

*** and while I am at it, how about cash for a facial expression package?

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This could get a little hairy

This could get a little hairy, pun intended.

If we're going to have it, I agree with the idea of having it an option for the client, default to off, and probably name it something fairly innocuous like "anatomical detail".

I love having options, but the KISS principle suggests to me that it's better to leave it all out. Everything that's in the game is a sacrifice of something else that is not. I'd much rather have better targeting, better mapping, note taking options on players/friends, built in history of chat, a way to see what missions I've completed or played with another given player, trading history per player, mission logs that cover every mission I've completed, additional costume pieces, classes, specializations, and on, and on.

I trust MWM will evaluate the ROI and prioritize this accordingly. I'm OK either way but suspect it's better to put those resources into other features.

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Hero_Zero wrote:
Hero_Zero wrote:

I love having options, but the KISS principle suggests to me that it's better to leave it all out. Everything that's in the game is a sacrifice of something else that is not. I'd much rather have better targeting, better mapping, note taking options on players/friends, built in history of chat, a way to see what missions I've completed or played with another given player, trading history per player, mission logs that cover every mission I've completed, additional costume pieces, classes, specializations, and on, and on.
I trust MWM will evaluate the ROI and prioritize this accordingly. I'm OK either way but suspect it's better to put those resources into other features.

I really wish people would stop arguing against things like this based on the "if the Devs waste time working on thing X we won't get more important thing Y" strawman. The theory behind that argument is completely false and misleading.

Software development is never a 100% zero-sum enterprise. MWM is comprised of a team of developers all doing various DIFFERENT things at DIFFERENT times. The people working on "better targeting, better mapping [...] classes, specializations, and on, and on" are likely NOT the same people who'd be involved in implementing an optional graphics detail like a nipple bump.

At the very worst the guy/gal who might be involved in something like adding a nipple bump might be involved with creating other costume items and/or character body modeling details. This means the greatest SACRIFICE we might have to face if MWM spends a bit of effort on nipple bumps is perhaps a few costume items or a body slider, each of which we'd likely get eventually anyway once the Dev spends a few more hours supposedly catching up.

Look, I totally get that there's probably 437,842 more important things for the MWM Devs to collectively do than to worry exclusively about a small detail like nipple bumpage. But asking for things like this simply DOES NOT represent a totally misguided reallocation of resources that would threaten the very existence of the entire CoT game. At most we're talking about a few hours of effort tops. And trust me when I tell you the Devs of MWM are already going to be spending hundreds/thousands of hours on other details you will also likely care little about as a player so the fact that they might choose to spend a few hours on one more thing like this is something none of us will even notice in the long run.

CoH player from April 25, 2004 to November 30, 2012

Hero_Zero
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Lothic, I appreciate your

Lothic, I appreciate your passion, but you seem a bit harsh to me.

Even as you discount my argument you note, "This means the greatest SACRIFICE we might have to face if MWM spends a bit of effort on nipple bumps is perhaps a few costume items...". I clearly said I'd rather have more costume pieces, "...mission I've completed, additional costume pieces, classes...".

Furthermore I have to wonder how much development you have done as your confidence in the level of effort would give me cause for suspicion. Often the simplest sounding things become nightmares to code. In addition to that you seem oddly familiar with the internal working of MWM. Being a small team I suspect each of them wears many hats. I suspect the moment they finish a task they start looking for some other way to move the project forward. I submit that the coding needed could become quite significant. I doubt such bumps should show through armor. Is that quality a simple setting? Do players get to adjust the size, shape, or location of the bumps? What about anatomical hair? What about other anatomical bulges? Do the avatar owners get to choose if bumps exist as opposed to the observer choosing to see them? Some may prefer that none of their avatars have bumps regardless of what observers want to see. Some may want only specific avatars to have bumps. Each of these require analysis and coding and could turn into a nightmare task.

If you think that's a "strawman" argument then there's still the fact that there are downside risks. Regardless of the level of effort, bumps could cost COT paying players.

As I said before, "I trust MWM will evaluate the ROI and prioritize this accordingly. I'm OK either way but suspect it's better to put those resources into other features." You can call it a strawman argument all you want, but I doubt MWM developers have a lot of free time regardless of division of responsibilities.

By the way this, "At most we're talking about a few hours of effort tops." is where I know you are wrong. You do not know that with certainty.

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Frankly I'd be happy seeing

Frankly I'd be happy seeing *a* female avatar. So far all the demo videos and photos have used the robot or male reference model.

*lightbulb*

Is there a female avatar? Or is it all just handled by a slider preset? IE there is only one avatar and enough sliders to slide out a gender appropriate form in small medium and large? I mean...it would make all the costume parts work. You wouldn't ever have unique male or female clothing.

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Grimfox wrote:
Grimfox wrote:

Frankly I'd be happy seeing *a* female avatar. So far all the demo videos and photos have used the robot or male reference model.
*lightbulb*
Is there a female avatar? Or is it all just handled by a slider preset? IE there is only one avatar and enough sliders to slide out a gender appropriate form in small medium and large? I mean...it would make all the costume parts work. You wouldn't ever have unique male or female clothing.

We actually showed the female one first, which is why the male has been front and center as of late.

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