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Discuss: What's It Mean? Alpha and Beta

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Brutum
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I've never claimed this thing

I've never claimed this thing is a scam I've just been getting frustrated lately.

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Brutum wrote:
Brutum wrote:

I've never claimed this thing is a scam I've just been getting frustrated lately.

Zerohour did, however.

Zerohour wrote:

It doesn’t “confirm“ anything. It’s just a picture. This is what I’m saying. Even after all the disappointments some people are way too willing to accept anything they show you or tell you. I’m at the point now where I’m not going to get excited until I see visual proof that these things are actually working. A little graphic with a specially coloured dot doesn’t confirm anything. I could draw you a picture of myself and say this is me at 6’4”, 220 pounds with blonde hair blue eyes and I drive a 2019 Lamborghini. But it isn’t until you visually see all that that you’ll believe me. This is no different.

So essentially their graphic showing progress isn’t “proof”, and it can’t be trusted. They are lying to the community. Until the game is released they can’t be trusted. That’s an accusation that we are being scammed.

It would be one thing to question predictions of when things will be ready. I’d be skeptical myself. But if they say “this is done” and you reply “I don’t believe you”, there’s no way to communicate productively after that.

Dissatisfaction like you express Brutum is absolutely understandable.

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Maybe I'm less of the bad guy

Maybe I'm less of the bad guy in people's eyes than I thought in that case, that's nice to hear.

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It it was a scam, then like

It it was a scam, then like all other scams the project would have been abandoned years ago after they got the money. They wouldn't bother making fake updates because what would be the point? And if your answer to that is "to try and get more money" then they would have done the second chance years ago then absconded with the take.

Game development takes a while. Especially when building an MMO from essentially scratch.

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Brutum wrote:
Brutum wrote:

Maybe I'm less of the bad guy in people's eyes than I thought in that case, that's nice to hear.

Considering that I can't remember anything specific "bad" post you've made makes me think that it's either not as bad as you think it is or it's delivered in a constructive and/or respective manner. That is, you've basically got nothing to worry about.

Zerohour on the other hand. The impression I have gotten of them is that the only thing they care about is the visual/aesthetic quality of the game, and any update that doesn't show a clear progress in that regard is a "bad" update. And much of what they calls "proof" can easily be faked. For many of us getting more info on the different mechanics and systems of the game is a good thing. The prime comparison has been with Ship of Heroes and while they have more videos and pics out showing a fair bit of the world and mechanics I feel that I know less about the game as a whole since there is basically no explanations of the mechanics/systems in question and only a basic showcasing.

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The game belongs to the

The game belongs to the corporation MWM. Said corporation is employee owned, but every employee still needs to sign an agreement laying out in clear legally defensible terms what they can and can't do.

We were supposed to announce the intent of the teasers this Thursday, but then NYCC happened. Hopefully those pictures of a certain familiar something on Cabbit's laptop being used to open the Avatar Builder will do until next week.

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Brutum wrote:
Brutum wrote:

Maybe I'm less of the bad guy in people's eyes than I thought in that case, that's nice to hear.

You're a good guy in my book.

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Shadow Elusive wrote:
Shadow Elusive wrote:

We were supposed to announce the intent of the teasers this Thursday, but then NYCC happened.

I think this is the point :D
How can you plan teasers and, some hours or even days before, realize there is the NYCC (which is not a small thing) and stop teasing or stop your communication plan just like that ? I mean, this seems like you have no one specialized in global communication or marketing.
I don't say it's easy of course nor "i know better than you", it's just a fact i noticed and which makes me react.
Why don't you look for someone who will have a global perspective on communication and "plan" or at least warn you about communication ? (as i read myself, i think it's not so easy to find someone like this :D)


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I appreciate that Tyche.

I appreciate that Tyche.

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TitansCity wrote:
TitansCity wrote:
Shadow Elusive wrote:

We were supposed to announce the intent of the teasers this Thursday, but then NYCC happened.

I think this is the point :D
How can you plan teasers and, some hours or even days before, realize there is the NYCC (which is not a small thing) and stop teasing or stop your communication plan just like that ? I mean, this seems like you have no one specialized in global communication or marketing.
I don't say it's easy of course nor "i know better than you", it's just a fact i noticed and which makes me react.
Why don't you look for someone who will have a global perspective on communication and "plan" or at least warn you about communication ? (as i read myself, i think it's not so easy to find someone like this :D)

TitansCity, Tyche is going to NYCC primarily as a visitor and he just happened to bring his laptop that has a version of the Avatar Builder on it as explained here by JWBullfrog.

JWBullfrog wrote:

It seems we've had a little confusion about Cabbit and the Avatar Builder software at NYCC. He is attending the Con as a visitor, and he has his laptop with him. He has a version of the Avatar builder Software with him, which he'll be happy to demonstrate to anyone that meets up with him. He is not distributing copies of the software to anyone...

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Glitch404 wrote:
Glitch404 wrote:
TitansCity wrote:
Shadow Elusive wrote:

We were supposed to announce the intent of the teasers this Thursday, but then NYCC happened.

I think this is the point :D
How can you plan teasers and, some hours or even days before, realize there is the NYCC (which is not a small thing) and stop teasing or stop your communication plan just like that ? I mean, this seems like you have no one specialized in global communication or marketing.
I don't say it's easy of course nor "i know better than you", it's just a fact i noticed and which makes me react.
Why don't you look for someone who will have a global perspective on communication and "plan" or at least warn you about communication ? (as i read myself, i think it's not so easy to find someone like this :D)

TitansCity, Tyche is going to NYCC primarily as a visitor and he just happened to bring his laptop that has a version of the Avatar Builder on it as explained here by JWBullfrog.

JWBullfrog wrote:

It seems we've had a little confusion about Cabbit and the Avatar Builder software at NYCC. He is attending the Con as a visitor, and he has his laptop with him. He has a version of the Avatar builder Software with him, which he'll be happy to demonstrate to anyone that meets up with him. He is not distributing copies of the software to anyone...

His point, as I understand it, is that if this is the week they planned to finally tell us what that update meant and it was pushed back because a dev went to a con...that it's his opinion there is something lacking with whoever is overseeing the communication. For a "big announcement" to be delayed like this, from our side of the fence, seems sloppy. Per their own reasoning on FB, they didn't want this announcement, hopefully the biggest announcement of MWM that they've been teasing, to compete with Warcabbit going to NYCC as a visitor. Monday, I believe it was, they posted on their Instagram story to look forward to today for big news but this isn't the news they were referring to.

I really couldn't care less that they pushed it back but I see Titancity's point about their communication. That is the single biggest issue I have with the team.

Compulsively clicking the refresh button until the next update.

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blacke4dawn wrote:
blacke4dawn wrote:
Brutum wrote:

Maybe I'm less of the bad guy in people's eyes than I thought in that case, that's nice to hear.

Considering that I can't remember anything specific "bad" post you've made makes me think that it's either not as bad as you think it is or it's delivered in a constructive and/or respective manner. That is, you've basically got nothing to worry about.

Zerohour on the other hand. The impression I have gotten of them is that the only thing they care about is the visual/aesthetic quality of the game, and any update that doesn't show a clear progress in that regard is a "bad" update. And much of what they calls "proof" can easily be faked. For many of us getting more info on the different mechanics and systems of the game is a good thing. The prime comparison has been with Ship of Heroes and while they have more videos and pics out showing a fair bit of the world and mechanics I feel that I know less about the game as a whole since there is basically no explanations of the mechanics/systems in question and only a basic showcasing.

I am guessing that we each have something that we classify as "important" and what we will accept as proof. Personally, I have never even looked at any of the lore. Not that its bad, but I prefer to learn about it inside the game. Other people see lore updates as the heart of the game. To each his own I guess. I am hoping that next week at this time we are hyped up over a major milestone they can share with us. we will just have to wait and see...

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Dark Cleric][quote=Glitch404
Dark Cleric][quote=Glitch404 wrote:

His point, as I understand it, is that if this is the week they planned to finally tell us what that update meant and it was pushed back because a dev went to a con...that it's his opinion there is something lacking with whoever is overseeing the communication. For a "big announcement" to be delayed like this, from our side of the fence, seems sloppy. Per their own reasoning on FB, they didn't want this announcement, hopefully the biggest announcement of MWM that they've been teasing, to compete with Warcabbit going to NYCC as a visitor. Monday, I believe it was, they posted on their Instagram story to look forward to today for big news but this isn't the news they were referring to.

I really couldn't care less that they pushed it back but I see Titancity's point about their communication. That is the single biggest issue I have with the team.

That was my point ^^ Thanks for being clearer than i was :)
This is supposition but yes, "if they delayed an announcement because there is another event to talk about", it means MWM have an issue on their global communication organisation. But, once more, we are discussiong about a volunteer and human size team :) My point was mostly to, i hope, help MWM to "understand" their public and some emotional reactions.


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ivanhedgehog wrote:
ivanhedgehog wrote:
blacke4dawn wrote:
Brutum wrote:

Maybe I'm less of the bad guy in people's eyes than I thought in that case, that's nice to hear.

Considering that I can't remember anything specific "bad" post you've made makes me think that it's either not as bad as you think it is or it's delivered in a constructive and/or respective manner. That is, you've basically got nothing to worry about.

Zerohour on the other hand. The impression I have gotten of them is that the only thing they care about is the visual/aesthetic quality of the game, and any update that doesn't show a clear progress in that regard is a "bad" update. And much of what they calls "proof" can easily be faked. For many of us getting more info on the different mechanics and systems of the game is a good thing. The prime comparison has been with Ship of Heroes and while they have more videos and pics out showing a fair bit of the world and mechanics I feel that I know less about the game as a whole since there is basically no explanations of the mechanics/systems in question and only a basic showcasing.

I am guessing that we each have something that we classify as "important" and what we will accept as proof. Personally, I have never even looked at any of the lore. Not that its bad, but I prefer to learn about it inside the game. Other people see lore updates as the heart of the game. To each his own I guess. I am hoping that next week at this time we are hyped up over a major milestone they can share with us. we will just have to wait and see...

I know that and fully recognize it. The "issue" here is with people who seem to have the mentality of that every update that doesn't deal with what they think is important and/or doesn't show enough proof of progress to their standards is better to have not been published in the first place. That is a very detrimental attitude to have both to self and the product as a whole.

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Cinnder wrote:
Cinnder wrote:

For what it's worth, storing character appearance but wiping experience and levels would be my preference for transition to Live.

The only concern I have on that is people getting into Beta and name-hoarding for RWT after the game goes Live.

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No - we did not want the post

No - we did not want the post to be competing with the hype around NYCC in general. The visit is simply taking advantage of Warcabbit living in New York. We can really only show up where a dev is already in driving distance.

Quote:

I mean, this seems like you have no one specialized in global communication or marketing.

Have we ever said that we do? As a volunteer studio, experts aren't always something we can get. Some things, if there's no expert, it can't happen. PR can, it just encounters issues like this.

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Bardweiser wrote:
Bardweiser wrote:

The only concern I have on that is people getting into Beta and name-hoarding for RWT after the game goes Live.

I thought Champions Online had a good solution for that, where no character name was locked, but each player could also be identified by their unique user name. So one character might be Blue Thunder (@FirstUserA1) and another Blue Thunder (@SecondUserB2) or something like that.

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fenianb wrote:
fenianb wrote:
Bardweiser wrote:

The only concern I have on that is people getting into Beta and name-hoarding for RWT after the game goes Live.

I thought Champions Online had a good solution for that, where no character name was locked, but each player could also be identified by their unique user name. So one character might be Blue Thunder (@FirstUserA1) and another Blue Thunder (@SecondUserB2) or something like that.

Same here, I'm hoping City of Titans plans to do something that allows that sort of flexibility. The name-hoarding in DCUO is ridiculous (and they've already had one purge and rumors are they might be planning something else).

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Definitely having a name

Definitely having a name@global system since day -2000 :p


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I am with Zero on this one;

I am with Zero on this one; in regards to seeing or playing something. I am a nice guy, or like to think of myself in that manner at least lol. Being nice, I am not going to get into specifics. We all know what we want, and what we need to see.

As a child, I thought my name was handsome, cause that is what everyone called me.

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Shadow Elusive wrote:
Shadow Elusive wrote:

Have we ever said that we do? As a volunteer studio, experts aren't always something we can get. Some things, if there's no expert, it can't happen. PR can, it just encounters issues like this.

Of course not :) I know it's probably really hard to find a communication specialist. But, as you never said you have one, "we" (think "i" ^^) could have believe you have one since you have talented people in redaction, drawing, technics, etc.
And, fortunately, the PR team is there and do a good job (to me) but PR is not Marketing and Product Communication . Hope you could find a volunteer in Marketing and Product Communication


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Also, don't forget, that when

Also, don't forget, that when they got access to UE4 it was still not ready for public consumption. In other words, that got "Beta Access" to a brand spanking new game engine. Of course there was a NDA signed.
(Proprietary, early access to a new and powerful game engine. Who wouldn't be forced to sign one?)

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TitansCity wrote:
TitansCity wrote:
Shadow Elusive wrote:

Have we ever said that we do? As a volunteer studio, experts aren't always something we can get. Some things, if there's no expert, it can't happen. PR can, it just encounters issues like this.

Of course not :) I know it's probably really hard to find a communication specialist. But, as you never said you have one, "we" (think "i" ^^) could have believe you have one since you have talented people in redaction, drawing, technics, etc.
And, fortunately, the PR team is there and do a good job (to me) but PR is not Marketing and Product Communication . Hope you could find a volunteer in Marketing and Product Communication

PR is having to double over to that area as best it can, always has. It's not great, but we all know the deal.

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chmeggma wrote:
chmeggma wrote:

i'm curious as to why you would sign an nda for your own game

I had to sign an NDA for my real job. Several of them, actually.

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I had to sign several

I had to sign several [REDACTED] too!


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The US Army holds my life in

The US Army holds my life in hock for the next 20+ years due to the agreements signed to read off of my clearance. Anything I publish they get to read first to ensure no classified data goes astray. Those agreements have teeth, dont think they dont.

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I expect it’s a rarity for an

I expect it’s a rarity for an employee at a software company to not sign an NDA. You will be in a position to see and hear things about that software which could be damaging if that information was leaked to a competitor and/or the public.

I worked at a medical software company once (as tech support) and I had an NDA I needed to sign before I worked there. I definitely knew a lot of inside info that could be damaging. It’s standard to require an NDA.

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DesViper wrote:
DesViper wrote:

Definitely having a name@global system since day -2000 :p

That is good to know. It is clearly one of the things that Champions Online did right.

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Gotta say not really high and

Gotta say not really high and never been low in spirit regarding CoT.....this is a MARATHON after all so 2020, 2021....as long as my 6 mo. old grandson hasn't graduated from college before this puppy has launched!

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I wonder if the roadmap

I wonder if the roadmap picture will be updated soon ^^


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TitansCity wrote:
TitansCity wrote:

I wonder if the roadmap picture will be updated soon ^^

It's only been a few months, with 2 major holidays, since they shared the road map with us. I doubt anything would have really changed. Nothing wrong with asking I guess...but I really doubt there's been enough progress to update the road map.

Compulsively clicking the refresh button until the next update.

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Dark Cleric wrote:
Dark Cleric wrote:
TitansCity wrote:

I wonder if the roadmap picture will be updated soon ^^

It's only been a few months, with 2 major holidays, since they shared the road map with us. I doubt anything would have really changed. Nothing wrong with asking I guess...but I really doubt there's been enough progress to update the road map.

Yeah, the holidays definitely slowed things down. It's picking up now that we're past 'em, but there's very little to change on it currently. One or two things, but not enough to warrant a full update about it.

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warlocc wrote:
warlocc wrote:
Dark Cleric wrote:
TitansCity wrote:

I wonder if the roadmap picture will be updated soon ^^

It's only been a few months, with 2 major holidays, since they shared the road map with us. I doubt anything would have really changed. Nothing wrong with asking I guess...but I really doubt there's been enough progress to update the road map.

Yeah, the holidays definitely slowed things down. It's picking up now that we're past 'em, but there's very little to change on it currently. One or two things, but not enough to warrant a full update about it.

Yea, that's understandable. Not enough time for even large companies to have any noteworthy changes to share.

Compulsively clicking the refresh button until the next update.

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Thank for the answer Warlocc

Thank for the answer Warlocc :)
@Dark Cleric, i'm so impatient i didn't think about that ^^ You are right.


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The tech team actually had a

The tech team actually had a big breakthrough earlier tonight with a UE4 plugin, I believe.
They were all kinds of excited. Hopefully we can give out some details about it soon.

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warlocc wrote:
warlocc wrote:

The tech team actually had a big breakthrough earlier tonight with a UE4 plugin, I believe.
They were all kinds of excited. Hopefully we can give out some details about it soon.

I like that kink of teasing :D


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TitansCity wrote:
TitansCity wrote:

I like that kink of teasing :D

I'm going to call that a typo.

A disturbingly appropriate typo.

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Darth Fez wrote:
Darth Fez wrote:
TitansCity wrote:

I like that kink of teasing :D

I'm going to call that a typo.

A disturbingly appropriate typo.

Thing !! I wanted to write Thing !! -_-'
:D


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thing of teasing, hmm not

thing of teasing, hmm not sure it's much better than kink :)

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'Kind' was likely the word

'Kind' was likely the word intended, as in, "I like that kind of teasing :D"

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It's all good. Let your freak

It's all good. Let your freak flag fly.

lol

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Joined: 09/20/2013 - 07:53
Like the lord of the flies,

Like the lord of the flies, wot wot.

<.< >.>

What?

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Hail Beard!

Support trap clowns for CoT!

TitansCity
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Joined: 10/28/2013 - 02:09
Totally right ^^ Thank you

Totally right Cobalt ^^ Thank you
i don't know why i made this mistake... twice !


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Cobalt Azurean
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Joined: 10/03/2013 - 16:39
TitansCity wrote:
TitansCity wrote:

Totally right Cobalt ^^ Thank you
i don't know why i made this mistake... twice !

One letter off, made sense to me.

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