What made CoH so fricking FUN?

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Lightning Flower
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Oh, goodness, I could go on

Oh, goodness, I could go on and on about what made CoX better than the rest, and why I still call it my favorite after so many years and other MMOs. I played CoX from i7 until about a week or two before i12 came out, which was a solid eighteen-ish months (I think more like 19 or 20). With my three main villains (Raad Na, Jasamune, Evalia Harenruyo) and three main heroes (Ethoria, Faye Rienne, Toyenna), it felt like I could do almost anything from the getgo, even if it was suicide to try.

They stepped away from the rats/rabbits starters - So many MMOs before and after tried to build you up as something powerful and epic only to fend you away from the important stuff, and even slapped you in the face with the chore of picking up the droppings no one wants to take care of. Go pick up this item that's five feet away, go kill these rodents that are passive but whatever they're dangerous go do it now, btw here's some lore about the great world that needs to be saved so now go talk to the next camp for more droppings! CoX was the first MMO I played that didn't feel like that. It threw you into a situation, showed you (especially on villain side) a fraction of the power that awaits you just outside of one fence, and it sent you packing heat into a fast-paced first mission.

Someone mentioned CO being a chore-riddled version of this--maybe not in those words, but still--and I'm inclined to agree. DCUO, regardless of the side you chose, started with the same mission, followed by exploring the building that applies to your side afterward, and then slowed things down until you got to the end of a story arc. CoX, however, didn't feel so much like it was letting up, at least not on Villain side. If CoT manages to keep up a good pace no matter what we end up playing as (Hero, Villain, in-between) until the first arc is done, then I'll find a hat so I may tip it.

The powersets were empowering - Imagine that; superpowers that had purpose before long into the leveling, and the starter abilities actually DID stuff without draining you and making you wait an eternity to move on. It wasn't until the more advanced powers where you blew your energy and had to wait a minute, but at least you knew that it did its job when used at the right time and place.

Keep in mind, I did feel the burn or slight of hand with my main being a (Ninja Blade) Stalker, but no matter what was or wasn't nerfed during my time in the game, it still felt like I was doing something with my abilities.

Trash mobs and lieutenants went down like the weaker mobs in Dynasty Warriors - Gods.... So I had quit FFXI before moving to CoV (and played Ultima Online before FFXI), so imagine my pleasant surprise when even my low-level, Ninja Blade wielding Stalker was tearing into crowds of Hellions and Skulls. Nobody likes walking up to a low ranking enemy and spending 20+ seconds wailing on it, especially when there were more right next to you. Or, in FFXI's case when I played that one, 5+ minutes. *shudders*

CO went this way for a while until alts had been the incredibly inedible endgame, and weeks later we finally had more content. Slowly but surely, that line of thinking went out the window, particularly for anyone not following a specific dps build. DCUO was OK, as were Warcrack and FFXIV pre-Heavensward, but I didn't feel like I was tearing up the small fry like I did in CoX. Of course, CoX's bosses and higher slammed my Stalker in the face every time when I went solo, but that's a different issue.

And back on topic with content and story arcs...

Was it just me, or did the NPCs seem more up with the times? - There are two sides to what I mean here. One goes back to before in the missions you were given off the bat. Even NPCs who didn't know you for whatever reason in CoX was reasonable in their test of your worth. They didn't go all like "I don't trust you at all *rawgle rawgle* go kill more rodents and do grunt work." They didn't send you to someone else when one or two or more NPCs ago sent you TO THEM BY NAME. They said, basically, you scratch my back and I'll scratch yours, and they sent you go start or stop a robbery, to beat up mobs from a faction that could very well include Lt or Boss tier enemies if there were enough people present for it, to do Odin-knows-what.

I never once felt like I was going back to a mundane square one. Par for the course with DCUO and CO, but not for MMORPGs. Friggin' FFXIV and its endless hours of that ****, in the main story alone.

Then there's how you could contact the NPCs after a time. Heck, sometimes you didn't even need the NPC because you had the newspaper or radio. For the NPCs you did talk to, however, plenty of them didn't need you to travel across x number of zones every single time to talk to them. Yes, hi, it's the 2000s and people have these things we carry around called cellphones. I don't recall CO doing this ever. DCUO had characters contacting you, but you still had to interact with them to initiate or end a mission. FFXIV had Linkshells that in-world characters could use to converse across the world, but you still had to travel to and talk to them (DAMN IT, MINFILIA!) when the quest consists entirely of just that - talking to people. CoX gave us the ability, after a fair time (in most instances) to call the NPC to turn-in or start anew.

When I first saw that with Burke's Call option, I wanted to dance.

Why settle for just dancing when you had styles, and a boombox? - *Peace*

RP was always optional - Even in Virtue, where I ended up after leaving Champion server, you had the option to RP anywhere, anytime, anyhow. Related to this was the number of emotes, which I'm going to have to say FFXIV actually beat. However, I'm inclined to like CoX more, though I cannot say it honestly since my memory of CoX's emotes is shoddy.

The AFK/Speech bubble - Got something to say to the person in front of you? That bubble was awesome.

The dialog was gratuitously and enjoyably cheesy - My own weakness when I write heroic or villainous characters (for my own projects) is the unbearably low ability to make mountains of white cheddar, brie, or emmental out of simple words. But, I would miss that sort of gab or banter if it wasn't present in CoT, because it was in CoX. DCUO, not so much. CO reduced it to lame puns, or a NPC shouting the same short phrase every ten seconds. Yes, Defender, we get it. We have to shut down or demolish ALL of the beacons.

The wanton destruction of the little things - Whether it's an online game like CoX, CO, or DCUO, or an offline one like an inFamous, the option to annihilate a parking meter, mutilate a trashcan beyond recognition, or send a car flying--in a superhero future, where we're not going to need roads--is perhaps icing on a cake. You wouldn't serve cake without icing would you? But, but... That would be like having a burly mountain of a man for a character and not have one of his outfits be a tutu. *Kicks a can*

The detailed character creator and the costume slots - It may not have been perfect, but I'm willing to look at CoX's creator like Courage the Cowardly Dog learned to look at most things in the episode "Perfect." It was beautiful for its time, resulting in many hours working on just one costume alone. Then the game went ahead and gave us five costume slots to a character. I have a friend on FFXIV who--if she ever played CoX--would have only come out of the character creator to either show off any number of new looks, or to make more money so she could pay for more changes. The closest to this I've seen actually was in FFXIV with the ability to change race or colors/appearance, as well as the ability to apply glamours to each class/job's gear (which can amount to something like 20 costume slots if you think about it). The ability to customize drew me in when I played CoX.

Bases - While CoX wasn't the first MMORPG to have customizable homes/bases, it was, in my opinion, the most impressive for the longest time (before I played FFXIV). You could decorate it to look like whatever you wanted out of it: a base, an underground home away from the Longbow and Circle getting it on upstairs, or for the potential to PvP with it. I understand I missed the PvP fun before I joined, and I heard nothing of it being returned afterward, but I remember trying to set up my hero and villain bases to make it as difficult as possible to reach key items in the base.

"Raad? Is there a reason you just bought a hundred desk lights?"

This was something no other game rally did right for a long, long time until a certain MMO by Squeenix. Trust me, I loved decorating so much in CoX and FFXIV that, had I enough enjoyment still in the game, I would have stayed on with FFXIV and opened a business to help people design their private homes or Free Company houses. On the other hand, housing is limited in that game by its number of living spaces. I don't remember such a limit in CoX - just as long as you could afford the base and its upkeep.

Compare to even CO. It eventually introduced bases. But, to even get the lowest one and decorate it, you had to grind heavily for drops. At that point, it felt more like a job than an opportunity. No matter how much effort I put into bases in CoX, it didn't feel like a job. It felt like a chance to further express myself or my interests.

I feel like I'm missing something. Ah well.

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Not to necro my own thread,

Not to necro my own thread, but out of desperation I re-downloaded the DCUO client last night--again : /...

Wish me luck!

FIGHT EVIL! (or go cause trouble so the Heroes have something to do.)

Hyperbolt
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I wish that I could have

I wish that I could have played COH, but that was before I ever heard of MMO's. I myself am an "MMO Hopper" I try one MMO for a week or two then I try another one. Other than LOTRO(which I have family that play it) I have not found an MMO That I really enjoy and make friends on. I also want a Superhero MMO that I can exercise my creative imagination without having to pay extra money for certain Powers (Champions dose that) Or being able to customize my characters close to exactly how I like it.
I

Come here Buddy, I never work alone.

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CoH was my very first MMO.

CoH was my very first MMO. Even before WoW (which also was out back then). CoH kinda spoiled me with there really good community that didn't give jack about how good a player you were unless you were a ass about it. In WoW and the MMOs after that I saw many many bad communities and problems that CoH never had....

Formerly known as Bleddyn

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Empyrean wrote:
Empyrean wrote:

Not to necro my own thread, but out of desperation I re-downloaded the DCUO client last night--again : /...
Wish me luck!

I'm redownloading DCUO Too, I can't stand the lack of character customization in Champions. I feel like I've been wandering in the MMO Wilderness for 40 years............Alright, actually only a year, but in that time I really never found a game to call my Virtual home away from home. Make COT My Promised Land.

Come here Buddy, I never work alone.

Lord Nightmare
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CaptainSabalan wrote:
CaptainSabalan wrote:

Empyrean wrote:
Not to necro my own thread, but out of desperation I re-downloaded the DCUO client last night--again : /...
Wish me luck!

I can't stand the lack of character customization in Champions.

Um... What?

Empyrean
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Lord Nightmare wrote:
Lord Nightmare wrote:

CaptainSabalan wrote:
Empyrean wrote:
Not to necro my own thread, but out of desperation I re-downloaded the DCUO client last night--again : /...
Wish me luck!

I can't stand the lack of character customization in Champions.
Um... What?

Agreed. Character Customization is one of the few things I really liked about CO. And the lack of it is one of the things I'm already struggling with in DCUO.

FIGHT EVIL! (or go cause trouble so the Heroes have something to do.)

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Empyrean wrote:
Empyrean wrote:

Lord Nightmare wrote:
CaptainSabalan wrote:
Empyrean wrote:
Not to necro my own thread, but out of desperation I re-downloaded the DCUO client last night--again : /...
Wish me luck!

I can't stand the lack of character customization in Champions.

Um... What?

Agreed. Character Customization is one of the few things I really liked about CO. And the lack of it is one of the things I'm already struggling with in DCUO.

CO actually pioneered the idea of being able to buy extra costume slots for each character in the game store. It took CoH about a year to finally "borrow" that feature from CO. While some may argue that the way CoH did it was relatively expensive all I know is that I had so much fun setting up multiple costumes for multiple characters that it was worth every penny to me. ;)

Overall I think CoH had better costume item options and better body model styling than CO but there's no denying that costume creation was one of CO's strengths.

CoH player from April 25, 2004 to November 30, 2012

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CO has superior choices for

CO has superior choices for certain costume ideas. CoH has superior choices for others. CO usually has better cape choices, CoH has a larger variety of gloves, tights, boots, etc.

A good idea is that if you want to make something that'd fit in well with anything from the Bronze Age and before, CoH is perfect. But for a very tech or magic oriented style and for Iron Age (90s) and after, CO is much better.

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You know what, screw it--I'm

You know what, screw it--I'm going to download Champions.

I want to make my heroes to the nines and to really feel Super when I play. And, while it's an unfinished and neglected game with insufficient content, and it suffers from an overly cartoonish look and feel, Champions does at least give you that.

FIGHT EVIL! (or go cause trouble so the Heroes have something to do.)

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What made CoH so fun for me

What made CoH so fun for me were the unlimited "dungeon" runs beginning at level 1.

Lin Chiao Feng
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Empyrean wrote:
Empyrean wrote:

You know what, screw it--I'm going to download Champions.
I want to make my heroes to the nines and to really feel Super when I play. And, while it's an unfinished and neglected game with insufficient content, and it suffers from an overly cartoonish look and feel, Champions does at least give you that.

Remember that the good classes are in the cash shop.

Has anyone seen my mind? It was right here...

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Trials and Task Forces.

Trials and Task Forces.

In my prime I used to only solo with my Mastermind to get Hero Merits during low population times. Then at night and on weekends I'd do whatever TF or Incarnate Trial everyone was up for.

R.S.O. of Phoenix Rising

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Empyrean wrote:
Empyrean wrote:

You know what, screw it--I'm going to download Champions.
I want to make my heroes to the nines and to really feel Super when I play. And, while it's an unfinished and neglected game with insufficient content, and it suffers from an overly cartoonish look and feel, Champions does at least give you that.

You can turn off "outlines" to get rid of the black line drawing outlines, to make it a little less cartoonish.

I usually turn off "bloom" in 3D games because that is the fogging out with distance, and I hate that.

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To be honest, I've been

To be honest, I've been thinking about this for a long while now, and I've been able to nail it down to about four things that made CoH such a great game in my mind.

1) Community - Let's face it. We had a great community. It was friendly. People were helpful. Out of the four things this is probably the one I need to explain the least. If you used the CoH Forums regularly, or talked on a lot of the Global Channels, then odds are you dealt with good people most of the time. Sure things weren't always perfect, and there were some troublemakers/trolls/trash talkers/people who just tried to start fights, but for the most part the people by and large were great towards each other.

2) Creative Expression - This covers a lot of ground. The costume creator covered a lot of this all by itself. After all, being able to have a unique costume that you created, that didn't look like anyone else (unless you wanted it to be that way) helped people express themselves creatively and made the game fun in some ways. But there was also base building (custom housing!), Architect Entertainment (custom missions and story arcs!), character builds (unless you used a build someone else made, or certain power combinations were 'OP' it was possible to more often than not to have a character power wise that was different from almost every other character in the game in terms of what they could do and how they did it!), Character Biographies (a way to read a paragraph or so about other peoples characters if they ever filled them in!), Crafting (More possibilities for unique builds due to IOs!), Wentworths (Sure Marketeers might have been 'Ebil', but how they cornered the market or made their Inf tended to be creative when they explained how they did it!). I could go on, but there were a lot of ways that people could, and were creative in CoH. Something that other games don't even try to do (i.e. insanely limited crafting, limited looks that are hidden in cash shops, very limited numbers of viable builds, no player created content, etc). Heck, when you look at how much the players in CoH could do, the game probably came close to crossing the line into a 'sandbox' game.

3) Content - Let's face it, despite certain things being run more often that other things (i.e. certain taskforces pretty much being almost mandatory, where as certain story arcs probably weren't run that often) it was possible to have a bunch of level capped characters where there was little, if any overlap in terms of what a player did content wise to reach the cap. There were Taskforces/Strikeforces, Paper/Radio Missions, Street Sweeping, and of course so many story arcs that I doubt any one player ever played through all of them. Sure some older games have a lot of content, and some newer games haven't been around enough to add a lot of playable content, but the sheer number of things that characters could do on their way to the level cap helped the game immensely. And that's still not even counting AE content.

And above all else...

4) There Was No Real 'Wrong' Way To Play - This is sort of a mixture of the previous three things, but let's face it. Not counting Incarnate content, there was so much to do, and so many ways to go about playing the game, and earning things in the game, that it felt like so long as you were playing, you were playing the game the right way. If you wanted to level an alt, you could, usually without hindering what you may have been trying to do with other chars. PvP? Feel free! Heck, once you leveled up enough to enter your first PvP zone you could level up almost exclusively in those zones (leaving mainly to train or go to another PvP Zone). Hit the level cap? You could make a new, and completely unique and different alt, or PvP, or badge, or play the markets, and and all of which offered a different form of 'advancement' in the game (i.e. people could see the huge number of badges you had, people could see all your 'Master of' Badges to show how hardcore you were with the high end TFs, you could rake in the PvP wins to have a high 'Bounty' in a certain PvP Zone, take part in PvP Tournaments, rake in tons of inf from just playing, corner the market in certain IOs, etc). This, above all else is something that certain other games (that aren't sandbox games) don't get since it feels like 'once you reach point X, you need to do X, Y, and Z, otherwise you can't advance in the game anymore, and if you solo/group play, you're playing it wrong from here on out'. Sure, you had 'The Trade-Off' at times in that if you constantly teamed, especially with big teams in CoH, you got Inf and Exp faster, but if you were going solo, you got to experience more of the immersion in the game in the form of story arcs, had more chances to get certain badges (i.e. Safeguard Badges or Badges associated with certain Missions/Contacts, etc.). Only the Incarnate stuff didn't hold out that well with this since there was so little Incarnate content outside of the 'Giant Group Raids', thus for the Incarnate stuff you pretty much had to grind those Raids for Incarnate stuff.

And sorry if that was spammy. And I'm sorry if I might not have phrased things as well or clearly as I'd of liked (thus maybe not making the points as easily understood as I'd of liked). But as I said, I've been thinking about this for a while, and felt like I finally had to get that off of my chest somewhere, to people who'd hopefully understand what I'm saying/trying to say.

The greatest high for a Blaster always will be annihilating huge mobs before anyone else knows that the enemies are even there.

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/signed all of Aoide's post.

/signed all of Aoide's post. Especially #4: games where you have to have a certain build or you're "gimped" suck. If I want to run the whole mission by pulling bad guys across fields of land mines, let me.

Has anyone seen my mind? It was right here...

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Lin Chiao Feng wrote:
Lin Chiao Feng wrote:

/signed all of Aoide's post. Especially #4: games where you have to have a certain build or you're "gimped" suck. If I want to run the whole mission by pulling bad guys across fields of land mines, let me.

My son and I used to use that tactic to duo at max level--and it was (yep, I'm going to be that cheesy) a blast!

I think one of the advantages CoH had was that, since they were the first Superhero MMORPG and there was no real precedent, there weren't hoards of people constantly saying "you can't do that" or "another game already did that."

They were relatively free to just focus on, "what would be awesome?"

FIGHT EVIL! (or go cause trouble so the Heroes have something to do.)

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I loved how anything was

I loved how anything was possible in CoH. Where else could a poor kitten from Kings Row grow up to be "The World's Mightiest Moggie"? I ask you!

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Only in the best world ever

Only in the best world ever!

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Empyrean wrote: Lin Chiao
Empyrean wrote:

Lin Chiao Feng wrote: /signed all of Aoide's post. Especially #4: games where you have to have a certain build or you're "gimped" suck. If I want to run the whole mission by pulling bad guys across fields of land mines, let me.My son and I used to use that tactic to duo at max level--and it was (yep, I'm going to be that cheesy) a blast!I think one of the advantages CoH had was that, since they were the first Superhero MMORPG and there was no real precedent, there weren't hoards of people constantly saying "you can't do that" or "another game already did that." They were relatively free to just focus on, "what would be awesome?"

Things stacked and stacke and stacked, and inspirations could rocket you up still more multiples in power...and people still ran the redline ragged edge of what they could handle.

No fancy balancing pve needed. Compare vs. say SW:TOR, where with each iteration you get less choice and power customization.

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I did not play COH/COV to the

I did not play COH/COV to the very end but some of the things I enjoyed about it were
1. The community - I am what people would call an introverted person, I tend to solo more often then not in these games and when I do group it is with people I know in real life or someone I have met through them. This wasn't the case in COH/COV its the one MMO that I found myself grouping with complete strangers more often then not in game and as strange as it may sound having a lot of fun doing it.
2. Customization - I don't think I played any game since that matched this game in this area.
3. Combat-I do not know why but the combat in COH/COV to me anyway felt more intense and fun then any other mmo I had played. I remember my first time doing a group in the sewers with my friends and thinking and even making a comment in group about how intense the combat was.I never really got bored with it like I have with other mmo's.

The only thing necessary for evil to triumph is for good men to do nothing.

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I joined the CoH officially

I joined the CoH officially when CoH Rouge came out! But I enjoyed the numerous combo of various power sets! I enjoyed the character creation and looking at other people's bios along with their own ideas! I was playing a super hero game where I could either choose hero/villain/or rouge and build my character the way I want! It was a vast experience for me to be able to create my own bio stories, imagine amazing names that I still use today as my usernames, and it really shaped me to love to play along with enjoy MMORPGs.

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White_Glint wrote:
White_Glint wrote:

CoH Rouge

>.<

- - - - -
Hail Beard!

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Must... Resist... Rouge

Must... Resist... Rouge Pencil tendencies!

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Fireheart

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I prefer the Avalonian

I prefer the Avalonian jeweller's rouge. ^_^

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Foradain wrote:
Foradain wrote:

I prefer the Avalonian jeweller's rouge. ^_^

Right, that's how you Completely confuse those gray-market arms dealers.

Be Well!
Fireheart

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Darth Fez wrote:
Darth Fez wrote:

White_Glint wrote:
CoH Rouge
>.<

Until CoH's Going Rogue expansion came out I never had much of a reason to write either "rogue" or "rouge" as words in text. I'm sure I read them plenty of times in their respective contexts but never really thought about how confusing they could be when placed side-by-side.

So just like any other words your don't write very often (if ever) I wasn't instantaneously sure which spelling meant "a dishonest or unprincipled person" or "a red powder or cream used as a cosmetic for coloring the cheeks or lips". Ironically enough CoH's Going Rogue forced me to actively memorize which word was which just so I could post about it in forums like these without looking stoopid. ;)

CoH player from April 25, 2004 to November 30, 2012

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Lothic wrote:
Lothic wrote:

Darth Fez wrote:
White_Glint wrote:
CoH Rouge
>.<
Until CoH's Going Rogue expansion came out I never had much of a reason to write either "rogue" or "rouge" as words in text. I'm sure I read them plenty of times in their respective contexts but never really thought about how confusing they could be when placed side-by-side.
So just like any other words your don't write very often (if ever) I wasn't instantaneously sure which spelling meant "a dishonest or unprincipled person" or "a red powder or cream used as a cosmetic for coloring the cheeks or lips". Ironically enough CoH's Going Rogue forced me to actively memorize which word was which just so I could post about it in forums like these without looking stoopid. ;)

Once, as a joke, I created 'The Rouge Rogue'. His main adversary was a rogue rouge smuggler.

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Mendicant wrote:
Mendicant wrote:

Once, as a joke, I created 'The Rouge Rogue'. His main adversary was a rogue rouge smuggler.

Nice. Those sound like characters that would be based in the Tickverse. :)

CoH player from April 25, 2004 to November 30, 2012

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Lothic wrote:
Lothic wrote:

Mendicant wrote:
Once, as a joke, I created 'The Rouge Rogue'. His main adversary was a rogue rouge smuggler.
Nice. Those sound like characters that would be based in the Tickverse. :)

Spoooooooooon!

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I remember seeing a character

I remember seeing a character named the Rouge Angle. Red with angel wings. So...yeah. They may have been intentionally tweaking everyone, or they could be one of those people who can't differentiate there and their, etc.

(insert pithy comment here)

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I agree with you, completely.

I agree with you, completely. CoH/CoV was truly an amazing game. The content was fun, challenging and entertaining. There was so much to do, and to me, "endgame" didn't exist. I was ingame, Nov 30, 2012 watching my home being disbanded. I took pics of the chat ingame, and still have that very last moment. I knew then, we all lost something magical. Atho after spending days/weeks/months/and now years, I have yet to find another game even somewhat close to this one. I too tried CO, I too tried DCUO, and I'm sorry to say, they weren't even close. I didn't like the "no brainer" playstyle of CO or their comic like graphics. I didn't like the lack of customization for either of them. I didn't like how upgrades changed your look. I too, spent HOURS changing my appearance or outfits on my toons. I loved and miss this game, because technique and playstyle were very important to your success. You could have two same builds, but their playstyle could be completely different from one another, depending on how you enhanced them. Ingame influ was easy to make, easy to spend and i LOVED how easy it was to give away! I would find new toons/players in Atlas, and give them a mil to get them started. Of course when I first started playing, you could only trade 9999 at a time, lol. And yes, Im sure some of the toons were alts, but i didn't care, it was something I wanted to do. If i felt restless, then I could go badge hunting and collect accolades to open up new powers, or switch toons for their day jobs, to earn badges and accolades. Or log someone in and write up a cool biography, and i KNOW i was not the ONLY one who ran around and read bios. Hosting costume contests or bio contests in Atlas Park and giving away influ or recipes to the winners (top 3). And don't forget the teams we would make while in Outbreak/Breakout to get the badges, lol. The fact that we COULD skip the orientation... Or head over to Oroboros and go back to missions you didn't have access to or forgot to complete. A bugged mission could be dropped or completed at a click, rather than force you to wait like many current games. Being able to sidekick or exemplar with friends, rather than most games now that "encourage" you to make an alt. I truly miss the task forces- the question of all..."kill all? or skip to main boss?" The sewer runs as a lowbie, that would level us fast, then you defeat yourself because you find yourself lost in the maze. The endless mazes of Perez Park, and you only get the missions deep in the forest when your level is too low for a travel power, once we were max lvl, we were sent to the office buildings outside the park. LOL.

I miss the teamwork we needed for difficult tasks, needing someone to inviso us to get us past, or the trip mines to help us, the bubbles for protection. I miss the hovering out of range while attacking or healing. I miss the tab to target, and the possibility of missing a shot. I miss teleporting people to safety, altho before they added tp prompt, people would troll and tp u someplace scary. I miss doing the respec missions, in terra volta with the reactor. I miss the story lines and the huge bonus' for completing a story arc. I miss having all the endless options for how you would like to lvl your toon. It wasn't about grinding to achieve something, it wasn't about opening your wallet to gain something. It was about enjoying the character you created and playing him/her. The levels came along just fine, because you enjoyed the many options we had. Yes, there were slow times, like looking forward to hitting lvl 32 or 38, of course 14 for travel power, or 41 for your epic pool. Which was a nice tie in to give a melee ranged powers, or ranged melee and protection. It made us a little more confident for survivability or taunt.

I currently play Neverwinter Online, and atho I am successful in there, it's not Heroes. I dislike grinding and working for something, getting it set up the way I want it, and then they nerf a keypoint to my build. When they do a major nerf, they give a free respec, however its not a choice. Its automatically done, so there is no writing stuff down, or taking pics (which i did before i respec'd) to ensure u grab the same stuff. Heroes would drop a free respec token for u to use when ready, not when they demanded. In additon, I occasionally play STO, Tera, and more, but seriously looking forward to CoT so I will no longer be "homeless"....I look forward to gaming with all of you there!!!

Mdaye75

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STO: Your two helpers plus

STO: Your two helpers plus turrets makes for a vague, half-hearted /traps MM. I find myself moving slowly through missions waiting for the turret to recycle just because it is more fun that way than ACTION ACTION ACTION SHOOT SHOOT SHOOT you are expected to do in every single MMORPG that ever was.

Except Champions petmaster, where you are still expected to, but end up holding block the entire battle while your wimpy pets chew down stuff while it attacks you.

__________________

The very existence of the taunting tank irritates, for it requires idiotic AI that obeys the taunt.

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Gorgon wrote:
Gorgon wrote:

STO: Your two helpers plus turrets makes for a vague, half-hearted /traps MM. I find myself moving slowly through missions waiting for the turret to recycle just because it is more fun that way than ACTION ACTION ACTION SHOOT SHOOT SHOOT you are expected to do in every single MMORPG that ever was.
Except Champions petmaster, where you are still expected to, but end up holding block the entire battle while your wimpy pets chew down stuff while it attacks you.

It is the tyranny of the many.

But this world is too bloatedly pregnant with people for that to be the only way any more. What, like 7.5 BILLION people?

Yes, the ACTION ACTION ACTION SHOOT SHOOT SHOOT can make the MOST money, because that's what, evidently, MOST people want---but there are still more than enough people left over to make other playstyles extremely viable and profitable.

You can easily make your living being option "C" in this world. I do...

It's called deep niche, and it's what CoT really is. And I THINK (pretty sure) they know it.

FIGHT EVIL! (or go cause trouble so the Heroes have something to do.)

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Simple: Has anyone listened

Simple: Has anyone listened to a song or a watched certain part in a movie( or even doing nothing) and it sends you into a instant nostalgia of a mission or event when your character was part of something bigger? I find that after all these years I can look back at a mission and remember something that was triggered by those said events. What I am saying is "awsome good story telling". I have played many single and MMO games and I can tell you that they never gave me that feeling to revisit that mission or event in my head, CoH was that game.

All 4 Mutants

Evolution is key. And mutants are key.

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Superman theme song. On rare

Superman theme song. On rare occasions. The best was way back before Incarnate, my thugs/traps MM. We had wiped multiple times and given up on tbe Recluse task force (or whatever one has you fight the entire Freedom Force under Atlas.)

So after everybody left, I stuck around to clear the map of yard trash for fun, quite the struggle then. And I saw them all under the statue and wanted to see how long I could last. I was a world-beating villain after all!

So I called all my pets, Backup Radio (a military guy), shivan thingie, and the giant robot from 200 alien points from the Rikti Crash site.

Ran in, hit NBC, threw down traps, hit Gang War, and bam!

I lasted over 30s. I was quite proud back then. Superman theme.

__________________

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Gorgon wrote:
Gorgon wrote:

So I called all my pets, Backup Radio (a military guy), shivan thingie, and the giant robot from 200 alien points from the Rikti Crash site.
Ran in, hit NBC, threw down traps, hit Gang War, and bam!
I lasted over 30s. I was quite proud back then. Superman theme.

You're referring to the Arachnos Reinforcement crab and the Vanguard HVAS, respectively, I believe. *sigh* good times......

R.S.O. of Phoenix Rising

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Bill was the first character

Bill was the first character I created. Had him on every server. Made tons of alts all over the place. But, here is the thing that I think made CoH stand out more than anything to me:

Customization was completely disconnected from power level. Most MMORPGs, every top-level cleric is going to look pretty much the same because gear. In CoH, you looked however you wanted and it had no bearing on your skills/ abilities.

Why this mattered- CoH was the only game I've ever played where I learned other players on sight. You'd be running through a zone and think "oh hey, isn't that SuperCarl, I haven't grouped with him in months!" People could build a reputation and some degree of familiarity. That's why it felt so much like a family. Every time in Atlas Park, I'd see several folks I'd known in game for years, or grouped with, or even just "well this is the 5pm-9pm weekday crowd."

In the last week of the game, I recognized names and costumes of people I hadn't seen since the game was released. To glimpse someone darting past that you saw a handful of times 5 years prior and recognize them? That's how you build a community over time. I was one of those folks standing in Atlas Park while the servers went down for the final time. I can't fathom ever caring enough about a game community to do that again.

...but I'm hopeful :)

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Radiac wrote:
Radiac wrote:

Gorgon wrote:
So I called all my pets, Backup Radio (a military guy), shivan thingie, and the giant robot from 200 alien points from the Rikti Crash site.
Ran in, hit NBC, threw down traps, hit Gang War, and bam!
I lasted over 30s. I was quite proud back then. Superman theme.
You're referring to the Arachnos Reinforcement crab and the Vanguard HVAS, respectively, I believe. *sigh* good times......

Backup Radio wasn't a crab backpack guy (zomg I could've gotten one of those, too? Danggggg!!!) It was a black ops looking guy. It was a one-shot craftable power you could buy on the market.

He wasn't very good, and didn't last very long before timing out, but he was a good speed bump.

Come to think of it, I had a few others from mission rewards that had limited charges. As they were a one time reward, I never used them. I never called that witch from the 10 Times The Charm reward, even though you got 10 calls I think.

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Bill of Rights wrote:
Bill of Rights wrote:

Bill was the first character I created. Had him on every server. Made tons of alts all over the place. But, here is the thing that I think made CoH stand out more than anything to me:
Customization was completely disconnected from power level. Most MMORPGs, every top-level cleric is going to look pretty much the same because gear. In CoH, you looked however you wanted and it had no bearing on your skills/ abilities.
Why this mattered- CoH was the only game I've ever played where I learned other players on sight. You'd be running through a zone and think "oh hey, isn't that SuperCarl, I haven't grouped with him in months!" People could build a reputation and some degree of familiarity. That's why it felt so much like a family. Every time in Atlas Park, I'd see several folks I'd known in game for years, or grouped with, or even just "well this is the 5pm-9pm weekday crowd."
In the last week of the game, I recognized names and costumes of people I hadn't seen since the game was released. To glimpse someone darting past that you saw a handful of times 5 years prior and recognize them? That's how you build a community over time. I was one of those folks standing in Atlas Park while the servers went down for the final time. I can't fathom ever caring enough about a game community to do that again.
...but I'm hopeful :)

I had a similar experience, though i didn't play as long as you - it was so easy to recognize people because expression through colors, through design, and everything else was so well made, so detailed. There was a guy I ran the Cimerora missions with, and three weeks later I saw him at Pocket D. We both recognized one another immediately and got to chatting about what had happened since we last saw each other.

That's interaction you can't buy.

An infinite number of tries doesn't mean that any one of those tries will succeed. I could flip an infinite number of pennies an infinite number of times and, barring genuine randomness, they will never come up "Waffles".

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Bill of Rights wrote:
Bill of Rights wrote:

CoH was the only game I've ever played where I learned other players on sight. You'd be running through a zone and think "oh hey, isn't that SuperCarl, I haven't grouped with him in months!" People could build a reputation and some degree of familiarity. That's why it felt so much like a family. Every time in Atlas Park, I'd see several folks I'd known in game for years, or grouped with, or even just "well this is the 5pm-9pm weekday crowd."
In the last week of the game, I recognized names and costumes of people I hadn't seen since the game was released. To glimpse someone darting past that you saw a handful of times 5 years prior and recognize them? That's how you build a community over time. I was one of those folks standing in Atlas Park while the servers went down for the final time. I can't fathom ever caring enough about a game community to do that again.
...but I'm hopeful :)

Whoa -- I had never considered that before. I liked the creative freedom afforded by the separation of costume and ability and I liked the CoX community, but the fact that the one helped engender the other completely passed me by. Of course, now that you say it it seems so obvious. Being able to recognise other characters on sight without having to focus enough to read their names is huge, and has far more impact than just avoiding the House of Mirrors aesthetic so many other MMOs end up having. Nice analysis!

Spurn all ye kindle.

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Fun is one of those terms

Fun is one of those terms that mean something different to different people.

For me - honestly, I found the game challenging in some respects. Taking a defender to level 50 solo - that was challenging, but it wasn't really "fun".

Some of the dialogue in the stories were interesting, and in limited instances humorous. But, fun?

The market - selling PVP IOs for 2 billion inf - that was ...motivating, but not really fun.

Farming for purples and other salvage and recipes - that was motivating, but really not "fun".

Soloing Dreck before they nerfed Burn - that was fun.
Taking my broad sword/invuln scrapper to the mother ship raid after a fresh respec had him maxed out at defense and resistance - that was fun.

Playing on an upgraded system with superior graphics - that was also pretty fun, compared to the lag-fests I used to endure.

Getting the Really Hard Way badge - that was awesome! One of the top three favorite moments in game - so much prep went into that.

Feeling you had to team to get any serious XP - not much fun.
The incarnate grind - and by that, I mean having to lead a trial and wait for a long time just to get people to join your league - not much fun.

Having people you'd never team with reduce your level of expectations from normal they were so ...unskilled and uncaring.
The endless chatter that was about nothing relevant 99% of the time - not fun.

Teaming with people who were on team-speak or ventrillo when I wasn't - not that much fun.
Teaming with people who were on team speak or ventrillo while I was on it with them - usually even less fun. Seeing a sexy avatar - yet hearing a deep base voice -- that was always weird to me.

Those who have no idea what they are doing have no idea that they don't know what they are doing. - John Cleese

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To be honest my favourite

To be honest my favourite thing about CoH was the mission/teaming system, it encouraged teaming (loved ramping up the difficulty with a good team!) but you could also solo content. I loved the fact you could log on at anytime and there would be a team that wanted a def, controller, tank, scrapper or blaster.. a lot of current MMO's have lost that encouragement for teaming and I'm hoping that CoT (still can't help but think of Circle of Thorns everytime I see that!) will keep to a similar system.

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SteelTouch wrote:
SteelTouch wrote:

To be honest my favourite thing about CoH was the mission/teaming system, it encouraged teaming (loved ramping up the difficulty with a good team!) but you could also solo content. I loved the fact you could log on at anytime and there would be a team that wanted a def, controller, tank, scrapper or blaster.. a lot of current MMO's have lost that encouragement for teaming and I'm hoping that CoT (still can't help but think of Circle of Thorns everytime I see that!) will keep to a similar system.

I agree, it's amazing is how successful CoH was for both teaming and soloing.

I love to solo and have always been mostly a soloer, only occasionally duoing with a friend or family member. CoH made it fun and easy to play solo, but yet it was also so fun easy to team that, in addition to the amazing community, I would team from time to time for a change of pace.

I teamed more in CoH than in any game after because the other games I've played made teaming a hassle and often not all that fun.

FIGHT EVIL! (or go cause trouble so the Heroes have something to do.)

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Empyrean wrote:
Empyrean wrote:

SteelTouch wrote:
To be honest my favourite thing about CoH was the mission/teaming system, it encouraged teaming (loved ramping up the difficulty with a good team!) but you could also solo content. I loved the fact you could log on at anytime and there would be a team that wanted a def, controller, tank, scrapper or blaster.. a lot of current MMO's have lost that encouragement for teaming and I'm hoping that CoT (still can't help but think of Circle of Thorns everytime I see that!) will keep to a similar system.
I agree, it's amazing is how successful CoH was for both teaming and soloing.
I love to solo and have always been mostly a soloer, only occasionally duoing with a friend or family member. CoH made it fun and easy to play solo, but yet it was also so fun easy to team that, in addition to the amazing community, I would team from time to time for a change of pace.
I teamed more in CoH than in any game after because the other games I've played made teaming a hassle and often not all that fun.

I think the major reasons for that success was that "solo" was just a team consisting of a single person, that it scaled to the teams size (or difficult setting) and that there wasn't a forced team composition (a.k.a holy trinity).

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1) you could run raids/team

1) you could run raids/team quests content/world bosses (badge stuff) straight through to max level just having to do the raid 1 time. You were technically grinding, but it was non-repetitive, the best part is this "highway" to max level, and most of the accolades was pretty well known in the community, openly discussed, and as a result finding a team to do it with you was simple. Or you could do the story line and solo to max level just as easily (all be it slower).

2) Finding parties was a cinche, PUPs worked (usually), and every class had a clear roll (even the outliers could play a roll, as typically only 2 or 3 of the slots on the team needed to be "certain" things

3) class flexibility/rolls, while certain things were expected with each class, there usually were enough "unique" aspects to the different power sets to allow players to build to non-standard themes and still be useful in a group. sure it might be harder for a damage focused defender to find a team but they could still find one, mostly because their skills were so multipurpose, even a damage focused defender like a RAD/RAD will have a lot of useful stuff for a team such as debuffs and group heals). I think the best blaster I saw was a fire blaster who spec'ed out as an iron-man clone who had high res and def, and liked to punch stuff. It was funny because he was like a cross between a blaster and scrapper and amazingly it worked. I liked the fact you could be a melee blaster (electric/electric) fully sapping foes of their power, while doing serious AOE damage, my personal favorite blaster to play was an iceman clone, ice/ice, who was basically a half controller, half scrapper. Huge defense numbers and high regen allowed melee combat, lots of freeze and holds and debuffs, melee damage with an icesword and that nuke. Was it the best DPS blaster out there? nope. it sucked in PVP too (too slow, def nerfed too hard in pvp), but man did it open eyes when people saw it in groups. no one ever complained about teaming with it... though I think it helps that I knew it's weakness (not great dps), so if I ended up in a team that was expecting it to be the main DPS I'd swap the character to my fireblaster which was a dps champ.

4) Feeling like a superhero. No matter what your build, if you're smart, could be made it great thanks to the slotting enhancements. I had a will/db tanker, who was basically unkillable (yeah, willpower, you know the redheaded stepchild of tanker def powers right next to darkness). When I made that willpower tanker I focused on enhancements sets I could socket in powers, did the math and found it was possible to hit the softcap def in everything (actually I think it's defense ended up at like 55%) while hitting the softcap regen max, while adding almost 100% to base hitpoints, and atleast 50% in all res. The result was a tanker who could regen each second more damage than most supervillains could dish out if my def or res was debuffed to 0 (to say nothing for how stupid crazy the regen got when MORE THEN ONE enemy surrounded it). Never needed support. never had a problem with agro management easily moving around the battlefield to keep agro. This was a tanker who could tank multiple supervillians without any team support at the same time (5 at once in one raid that went badly, held them off after the rest of the team wiped to a AOE attack, waited 10 minutes, no support or buffs or heals for the team to return). There were controllers who could take down world bosses solo (ill/rad), yet those same controllers despite being solo powerhouses with almost no control, would be highly sought after in raids because of their terrifying debuff/healing and DPS. There were scrappers who were good enough to tank for most content, while still being one of the primary party dps. My aforementioned Ice Blaster actually was able to tank a raid or two with good healing/buffing support. In the end you could build a hero and FEEL LIKE A HERO

5) Varied powers/abilities that FEEL DIFFERENT. the one thing I can't stand about other MMOs is how all the powers feel like just reskinned versions of the last power. their abilities are lame, and effects don't last long.

6) control == control. I hate I can't find a controller surrogate in another mmo. freezing the battlefield was fun. Having played in COH with and without controllers and I can't even say the power was overpowered. sure it changed how battles were fought when you had one, but then that's what EVERYONE did. a team without a healer would fight differently then one with a healer. a team without a tanker fought differently then one without. the way other MMOs live in constant fear of granting a 1 second lockdown blows my mind. Sure control is strong but then so is a character who can deal thousands of damage per second. I think team play and strategy is harmed in other MMOs when you take away the ability to lock down a room.

7) travel powers. Why has it been over 7 years since the end of COH and we still haven't seen a solid teliport moving power like COH? what about super speed? what about flying AND fighting. and superjump was easily my fav mode of travel out of all of them.

8) lvl.1 powers can be as strong as end content powers. Granted not everyone was using their basic lvl.1 attack at end content, but the fact that many people STILL had it in their quickbar tells you something key. Powers scaled with levels well. only a handful of powers seems worthless, in fact almost every power could be used and part of a build

9) areas were fun to just travel around in (sort of like the latest GTA game).

10) always something happening

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Even after being part of this

Even after being part of this project from the beginning, I've been occasionally flabbergasted to realize that some of the new people we've brought in are people I know very well from City of Heroes. The fact of the matter is, it was my social network for years, even above Facebook, and we're still finding each other. :)

That's not too much of a headache. Though considering in this case, "much" is essentially 3.141592(ei- ie) over 0.

Marketing Manager

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Just playing CoH was fun.

Just playing CoH was fun. Everything from the CC to end phase. I found that around lv30 was the "golden period" for me, where things flowed nicely. Not too fast, but not too slow either.

I would EASILY spend 2hrs setting up a character in the CC screen and was VERY enjoyable for me to do, thinking of how I wanted each of them to "evolve" as I unlocked more costume slots.

I wish I had spent more time on my Titan character, as I was really enjoying that power set.

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CoH was a slower game in the

CoH was a slower game in the beginning than it was near the end of life. You had to WORK for those levels early on, and you got MAD when someone "got you killed" by not healing you enough or something. In the last year of the game people would volunteer to be your Vengeance target if you needed one (required them to be defeated).

I think MWM should aim for the slow leveling of early CoH, at least at first, because power creep will eventually cause that to accelerate anyway. Plus early on the game is new to everyone, later you end up doing a lot of the same stuff on a new toon anyway. I also think tutorials that teach you how to use WASD to move, how to craft, etc ought to be optional after you've done them once on one toon. Allowing people to repeat content because they want to try to do it again, or do it better or do it at higher difficulty, etc is good, making stuff "forced repeatable" to unlock the same functions on a new toon is boring and dull.

While I'm on a rant, I think the way CoX handled respecs when they tweaked the powers was bad. Instead of allowing people to accumulate many many freespecs as different powers tweaks were implemented, they should instead give people a respec that has a time limit on it. If you don't use it in say two weeks, it disappears forever. Then, maybe have ONE "saved respec" slot per character that can be filled by any of the respecs you've gotten, but no more. So if you have your saved respec in your pocket, you can use the new one you just got before it evaporates, or you can just ignore it and let it go. The game ought to be smart enough to revert any respec that's about to die to your saved one if that slot is empty, so you never lose one when you COULD have saved it.

R.S.O. of Phoenix Rising

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If there are going to be

If there are going to be tutorials that mention specific keys, please make the key names in the text variables that reference the player's keymap configuration. For example, I don't use WASD for movement, so it would be nice for the tutorial to show me the arrow keys instead. But, aye, Radiac has a good point about making any tutorial skippable. I'm sure I'll go through it with every new character, but I wouldn't want anyone to be forced to do so.

Radiac, why was having multiple respecs saved up a bad thing in your opinion? I considered it a reward for having played the game for so long.

Spurn all ye kindle.

Redlynne
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Ironically, I think that

Ironically, I think that Vanilla World of Warcraft hit on the right formula for respecs. In their case it was a 1 gold cost for the first one (which was hella expensive for a new character in the 10-20 range!) and each respec after the first one incremented the cost upwards until reaching a cost cap of 50 gold (so 1-50 gold range for respec costs). Over time, if you didn't keep using respecs all the time, the cost would come back DOWN, giving you a "reward" for not using respecs too often. So each time you used a respec, it was an increment of +1 tick on the cost table, and after a month of NOT using a respec, you'd get a decrement of -1 tick on the cost table ... meaning that PATIENCE between respecs yielded a financial advantage over constant respecs.

Needless to say, a lot of "raiding" Players soaked the cost of multiple respecs per week so as to optimize their builds for specific raid content, PvE farming and PvP, all of which placed different demands on the "optimal" build strategies, which in turn drained 100s of gold out of the economy thanks to the "constant churn" of respecs these highly competitive Players were paying for.

Even if City of Titans doesn't go so far as to provide similar motivation for using respecs on too frequent a basis, using a similar structure of making respecs an IGC sink would seem to be a prudent choice. Why? Because it "rewards" Players who settle on a stable build strategy they use for everything, while at the same time being a "drain" on Players/Characters that are constantly wanting/needing to respec (for whatever reason).


Verbogeny is one of many pleasurettes afforded a creatific thinkerizer.
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You didn't need a Supergroup

You didn't need a Supergroup to get fun for months with 8 unknown peoples each day. You didn't even need to stay in a level range and the fight was fun from the first level, I loved the part where you leave the park and start hitting the thugs saving old women purses etc.

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Cinnder wrote:
Cinnder wrote:

If there are going to be tutorials that mention specific keys, please make the key names in the text variables that reference the player's keymap configuration. For example, I don't use WASD for movement, so it would be nice for the tutorial to show me the arrow keys instead.

I hope the devs pay attention to this. I highly recommend this as well. This should be doable. I have already seen this done in several games. As soon as I change the keymap, the game tells me to use the key that I mapped it to rather than the default. Brilliant.

Some games, however, haven't done this, and that gets confusing when it tells me to use [F] and I can't remember what keybind used to be [F].

Usually the tutorials are a produced affair and use the default keys in their instructions. That's okay, so long as in-game tooltips and pop-up windows use my own keymapping.

(COH)Blue Side_________Red Side
Little Panda....................Aissa
Thunderbird Priest.....Ash Khepri
Red Scirocco.............Bloody Mandragora
Dream Gypsy............Sinister Slate

Radiac
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I never played WoW but I like

I never played WoW but I like the respec thing Red described. And my original motivation for not giving out freespec all the time was simple: we're trying to sell respec tokens in the cash shop, aren't we? Even if we're really not doing that, they'll be available for IGC eventually I would assume and why undercut that economy with freebies all over the place? There's some kind of cow/milk lesson in there I think, but I also dislike farming in MMOs, so I'm not going to think about it any more than that :P

So maybe instead of handing out respec tokens for free when there are rules tweaks, just have a grace period during which each toon can be respecced once for free just by going to the respec NPC at the right time. Then after the grace period is over, you're back to having to pay for them again. And again, that's one per toon, and even then only if you start it during a grace period that is offered immediately after a power rules tweak.

Because the one problem with the "escalating cost of respecs" idea is that when the devs tweak the rules, people complain that it's a thinly veiled cash grab because invariably you end up wanting to respec your toon to adjust for the changes.

All of that said, I like the idea of making people pay IGC if they're going to rebuild their toon differently for every different TF or raid that comes along. Also, I like the idea of writing the TFs and raids in such a way that winning them on the highest difficulty settings almost requires doing just that. Hey, if you're going for that "The REALLY Hard Way" badge or whatever, you gotta be willing to work for it. So maybe you need to spend some IGC on the respec (not to mention the gear you need).

R.S.O. of Phoenix Rising

Empyrean
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Huckleberry wrote:
Huckleberry wrote:

Cinnder wrote:
If there are going to be tutorials that mention specific keys, please make the key names in the text variables that reference the player's keymap configuration. For example, I don't use WASD for movement, so it would be nice for the tutorial to show me the arrow keys instead.
I hope the devs pay attention to this. I highly recommend this as well. This should be doable. I have already seen this done in several games. As soon as I change the keymap, the game tells me to use the key that I mapped it to rather than the default. Brilliant.
Some games, however, haven't done this, and that gets confusing when it tells me to use [F] and I can't remember what keybind used to be [F].
Usually the tutorials are a produced affair and use the default keys in their instructions. That's okay, so long as in-game tooltips and pop-up windows use my own keymapping.

+1

I bind all movement to my mouse and all combat/function to my keyboard whenever allowed. So much better than wasd, at least for me.

Also, as much as MWM is trying to be accessable to people with particular needs, these things will be very important.

FIGHT EVIL! (or go cause trouble so the Heroes have something to do.)

Brand X
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Redlynne wrote:
Redlynne wrote:

Ironically, I think that Vanilla World of Warcraft hit on the right formula for respecs. In their case it was a 1 gold cost for the first one (which was hella expensive for a new character in the 10-20 range!) and each respec after the first one incremented the cost upwards until reaching a cost cap of 50 gold (so 1-50 gold range for respec costs). Over time, if you didn't keep using respecs all the time, the cost would come back DOWN, giving you a "reward" for not using respecs too often. So each time you used a respec, it was an increment of +1 tick on the cost table, and after a month of NOT using a respec, you'd get a decrement of -1 tick on the cost table ... meaning that PATIENCE between respecs yielded a financial advantage over constant respecs.
Needless to say, a lot of "raiding" Players soaked the cost of multiple respecs per week so as to optimize their builds for specific raid content, PvE farming and PvP, all of which placed different demands on the "optimal" build strategies, which in turn drained 100s of gold out of the economy thanks to the "constant churn" of respecs these highly competitive Players were paying for.
Even if City of Titans doesn't go so far as to provide similar motivation for using respecs on too frequent a basis, using a similar structure of making respecs an IGC sink would seem to be a prudent choice. Why? Because it "rewards" Players who settle on a stable build strategy they use for everything, while at the same time being a "drain" on Players/Characters that are constantly wanting/needing to respec (for whatever reason).

I'm thinking, less of a drain and more of a good way to create a money sink for the game. :)

Rigel
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Whatever method they use to

Whatever method they use to dole out respecs, I really hope we have a system akin to CO's Powerhouse where we can freely undo/redo and test our options before "locking in" our build.

Empyrean
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Rigel wrote:
Rigel wrote:

Whatever method they use to dole out respecs, I really hope we have a system akin to CO's Powerhouse where we can freely undo/redo and test our options before "locking in" our build.

Agreed.

Actually, my son (who is 21 and literally grew up on CoH) and I were just talking about the few seeds of greatness that were in the travesty that is CO--Powerhouse, the Comic Series Aftershock and Whiteout, the (potential that the) Nemesis System (has), the Multifarian Earth missions, where, among other things, YOU GET TO DRIVE A GIANT FREAKING ROBOT AGAINST GIANT MONSTERS!

Champions Online was like a pile of crap with a handful of amazing diamonds scattered through it. But, man, MWM should mine those diamonds. There's some good stuff in there.

FIGHT EVIL! (or go cause trouble so the Heroes have something to do.)

blacke4dawn
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Empyrean wrote:
Empyrean wrote:

Rigel wrote:
Whatever method they use to dole out respecs, I really hope we have a system akin to CO's Powerhouse where we can freely undo/redo and test our options before "locking in" our build.
Agreed.
Actually, my son (who is 21 and literally grew up on CoH) and I were just talking about the few seeds of greatness that were in the travesty that is CO--Powerhouse, the Comic Series Aftershock and Whiteout, the (potential that the) Nemesis System (has), the Multifarian Earth missions, where, among other things, YOU GET TO DRIVE A GIANT FREAKING ROBOT AGAINST GIANT MONSTERS!
Champions Online was like a pile of crap with a handful of amazing diamonds scattered through it. But, man, MWM should mine those diamonds. There's some good stuff in there.

I'm certain they have said that they are planning to implement something similar to CO's Powerhouse.

Brand X
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Just have the amount of

Just have the amount of enemies that CoH had, rather than how CO has them. I feel like I do more walking than fighting in CO. :/

Redlynne
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Brand X wrote:
Brand X wrote:

Just have the amount of enemies that CoH had, rather than how CO has them.

So ... this?

Ah, fond memories of charging Lagmonster Hill with all those tasty Romans (just for me!).


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Yes! In CO you're attacking

Yes! In CO you're attacking 2-3 baddies then walking and walking and walking for 2-3 more! :/

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