Announcements

Join the ongoing conversation on Discord: https://discord.gg/city-of-titans-official-633757967899951105

Q2 Update is live. See what we've been up to.

To purchase your copy of the City of Titans Launcher, visit our store at https://store.missingworldsmedia.com/ A purchase of $50 or more will give you a link to download the Launcher for Windows or Mac based machines.

Question about Firing Point Pets.

24 posts / 0 new
Last post
Cyclops
Cyclops's picture
Offline
Last seen: 3 years 2 months ago
11th Anniversary Badge
Joined: 04/10/2015 - 17:24
Question about Firing Point Pets.

I'm referring to Pidgeon-Man as seen in this kickstarter article:
https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/missingworldsmedia/the-phoenix-project-city-of-titans/posts/625583
[img]http://s11.postimg.org/8haqtwjbn/8eed6b5197080fc9486400005f075c60_original.png[/img]

I am not an animator. I imagine it requires a whole new skeleton to animate a non bipedal creature. COH only introduced 4 legged creatures in the last few years. A bird was never developed.

This is NOT the mastermind set...its just a firing point for a Blaster.
I've been joking about shoulder kitties being firing points...But in this case I refer to mobile, animated pets.

the animal firing points may not be available at release, simply for the time it will take to animate them. BUT. There are other pets available that requite no new animations.

A robot drone or the Emerald Queen's floating eye. Both are floating inanimate objects.

But I'm inspired by a third floating possibility, that by launch you will ALREADY have animations for.
These are little floating people ala Shadow Run. They were like little city spirits that float around the hero. One would look like a pony-tailed hipster in a suit and sunglasses.

If we allow player creation of such a little floating guy, the possibilities will be endless!
Fairies, little genies, tiny mobsters with tiny machine guns...Homunculi

The animations will be there. The character creation will be there. all the tools to set COT apart from any other game will be there and likely for FREE.or for cheaper than you might think.

Devs, players...what do ya think?

[img]https://s15.postimg.cc/z9bk1znkb/Black_Falcon_Sig_in_Progess.jpg[/img]

Lothic
Lothic's picture
Offline
Last seen: 6 months 6 days ago
kickstarter11th Anniversary Badge
Joined: 10/02/2013 - 00:27
I'm sure any type of critter

I'm sure any type of critter that's generally human-shaped would likely be easier to create than some other kind of unique animal or object with different types of arm/legs. That being the case getting a human-shaped miniature shoulder pet (like a fairy or little imp) as a firing point would likely be more doable than say a shoulder squid.

I think the whole idea of "firing points" that exist somewhere beyond the basic body of the character is a neat idea that could easily snowball into dozens of types in the long run. But to be honest I could live with only a few basic ones at launch if it would help the Devs concentrate on more important things first. I'd consider this kind of thing "icing on the cake" that could be added after launch. The Devs really need to make sure the rest of the game works well before they need to worry too much about floating laser-eyed chipmunks or the like.

CoH player from April 25, 2004 to November 30, 2012
[IMG=400x225]https://i.imgur.com/NHUthWM.jpeg[/IMG]

Kiyori Anoyui
Kiyori Anoyui's picture
Offline
Last seen: 10 months 1 week ago
kickstarter11th Anniversary Badge
Joined: 10/10/2013 - 11:03
Nothing is more important

Nothing is more important than floating laser-eyed chipmunks, you seriously need to get your priorities in order =3

The Carnival of Light in the Phoenix Rising
"We never lose our demons, we only learn to live above them." - The Ancient One

Avatar by lilshironeko

Tannim222
Tannim222's picture
Offline
Last seen: 1 year 2 months ago
Developer11th Anniversary Badge
Joined: 01/16/2013 - 12:47
The idea in the video is that

The idea in the video is that the "bird" is really just another emenation point for the character's power. And really is only limited by what type of skeletal mesh we can apply be it bird or round-shaped object. We are also not necessarily limited to floating-off-shoulder locations either, but could have off to the side at thigh height too. While we may not necessarily have many (if any) working animal rigs by launch, we will have the human rig. Size scaling is simple enough, as is the general tethering, following, and related animations. Which means something like a fairy is not out of the realm of possibility. The limiter here is providing sufficient options for inclusion at launch. Eventually though we are looking at unparallelled customization.

[hr]I don't use a nerf bat, I have a magic crowbar!
- Combat Mechanic -
[color=#ff0000]Tech Team. [/color]

Kiyori Anoyui
Kiyori Anoyui's picture
Offline
Last seen: 10 months 1 week ago
kickstarter11th Anniversary Badge
Joined: 10/10/2013 - 11:03
Another cool concept is Ferra

Another cool concept is Ferra/Torr in Mortal Kombat where the pet IS the projectile. And it can either be on you or following you.

So you have the character who is a meat shield with a lot of strength and a girl with high int and gadgets. Alone they aren't much of a threat but combined are a super force

To add to that, your actual character could be the pet and you could be on the back or shoulder of another character. For example, Bran and Hodor from Game of Thrones

The Carnival of Light in the Phoenix Rising
"We never lose our demons, we only learn to live above them." - The Ancient One

Avatar by lilshironeko

Cyclops
Cyclops's picture
Offline
Last seen: 3 years 2 months ago
11th Anniversary Badge
Joined: 04/10/2015 - 17:24
Tannim222 wrote:
Tannim222 wrote:

The idea in the video is that the "bird" is really just another emenation point for the character's power. And really is only limited by what type of skeletal mesh we can apply be it bird or round-shaped object. We are also not necessarily limited to floating-off-shoulder locations either, but could have off to the side at thigh height too. While we may not necessarily have many (if any) working animal rigs by launch, we will have the human rig. Size scaling is simple enough, as is the general tethering, following, and related animations. Which means something like a fairy is not out of the realm of possibility. The limiter here is providing sufficient options for inclusion at launch. Eventually though we are looking at unparallelled customization.

Now that is a promising development.

This is why I'm here...the sheer promise of the game!
Tannim, thank you. I think the world of this development team!

[img]https://s15.postimg.cc/z9bk1znkb/Black_Falcon_Sig_in_Progess.jpg[/img]

Lothic
Lothic's picture
Offline
Last seen: 6 months 6 days ago
kickstarter11th Anniversary Badge
Joined: 10/02/2013 - 00:27
Kiyori Anoyui wrote:
Kiyori Anoyui wrote:

Another cool concept is Ferra/Torr in Mortal Kombat where the pet IS the projectile. And it can either be on you or following you.
So you have the character who is a meat shield with a lot of strength and a little guy with high int and gadgets. Alone they aren't much of a threat but combined are a super force

This might blur the line between "a fancy critter animation where an attack power projects from" and "a combat pet with its own HPs and attack powers". I suppose as long as the "little guy" in your example is just a fancy animation of an attack power being used by the "big guy" then it might work.

CoH player from April 25, 2004 to November 30, 2012
[IMG=400x225]https://i.imgur.com/NHUthWM.jpeg[/IMG]

Kiyori Anoyui
Kiyori Anoyui's picture
Offline
Last seen: 10 months 1 week ago
kickstarter11th Anniversary Badge
Joined: 10/10/2013 - 11:03
Lothic wrote:
Lothic wrote:

Kiyori Anoyui wrote:
Another cool concept is Ferra/Torr in Mortal Kombat where the pet IS the projectile. And it can either be on you or following you.
So you have the character who is a meat shield with a lot of strength and a little guy with high int and gadgets. Alone they aren't much of a threat but combined are a super force

This might blur the line between "a fancy critter animation where an attack power projects from" and "a combat pet with its own HPs and attack powers". I suppose as long as the "little guy" in your example is just a fancy animation of an attack power being used by the "big guy" then it might work.

That is what I was thinking, so you would have a power that would both pick up said little guy, then throw it, like the shield toss in CoH

Meaning, that the two characters are intertwined power wise, not with their own sets. The only question, and still a question as far as Pets with attack points go, do they have shared HP, or their own HP, and how much will they have?

The Carnival of Light in the Phoenix Rising
"We never lose our demons, we only learn to live above them." - The Ancient One

Avatar by lilshironeko

Cyclops
Cyclops's picture
Offline
Last seen: 3 years 2 months ago
11th Anniversary Badge
Joined: 04/10/2015 - 17:24
Kiyori Anoyui wrote:
Kiyori Anoyui wrote:

Lothic wrote:
Kiyori Anoyui wrote:
Another cool concept is Ferra/Torr in Mortal Kombat where the pet IS the projectile. And it can either be on you or following you.
So you have the character who is a meat shield with a lot of strength and a little guy with high int and gadgets. Alone they aren't much of a threat but combined are a super force

This might blur the line between "a fancy critter animation where an attack power projects from" and "a combat pet with its own HPs and attack powers". I suppose as long as the "little guy" in your example is just a fancy animation of an attack power being used by the "big guy" then it might work.

That is what I was thinking, so you would have a power that would both pick up said little guy, then throw it, like the shield toss in CoH
Meaning, that the two characters are intertwined power wise, not with their own sets. The only question, and still a question as far as Pets with attack points go, do they have shared HP, or their own HP, and how much will they have?

I think they will just be a focus point. If you want pets with hit points...be a mastermind.
In this scenario, and damage the focus point takes...YOU will take.

[img]https://s15.postimg.cc/z9bk1znkb/Black_Falcon_Sig_in_Progess.jpg[/img]

Lothic
Lothic's picture
Offline
Last seen: 6 months 6 days ago
kickstarter11th Anniversary Badge
Joined: 10/02/2013 - 00:27
Kiyori Anoyui wrote:
Kiyori Anoyui wrote:

Lothic wrote:
Kiyori Anoyui wrote:
Another cool concept is Ferra/Torr in Mortal Kombat where the pet IS the projectile. And it can either be on you or following you.
So you have the character who is a meat shield with a lot of strength and a little guy with high int and gadgets. Alone they aren't much of a threat but combined are a super force

This might blur the line between "a fancy critter animation where an attack power projects from" and "a combat pet with its own HPs and attack powers". I suppose as long as the "little guy" in your example is just a fancy animation of an attack power being used by the "big guy" then it might work.

That is what I was thinking, so you would have a power that would both pick up said little guy, then throw it, like the shield toss in CoH
Meaning, that the two characters are intertwined power wise, not with their own sets. The only question, and still a question as far as Pets with attack points go, do they have shared HP, or their own HP, and how much will they have?

No that's the point I was trying to make with my last post. As Cyclops said I don't think that the critters that would serve as firing points are going to be actual "pets" in terms of being a separate entity with their own HPs or targetable in combat. They would literally be more like the "shoulder pets" in CoH but simply physically disconnected from the character's body and animated to "look" like living critters.

CoH player from April 25, 2004 to November 30, 2012
[IMG=400x225]https://i.imgur.com/NHUthWM.jpeg[/IMG]

Kiyori Anoyui
Kiyori Anoyui's picture
Offline
Last seen: 10 months 1 week ago
kickstarter11th Anniversary Badge
Joined: 10/10/2013 - 11:03
Yea, that would make sense. I

Yea, that would make sense. I guess what I was talking about would be more along the lines of a mastermind. But then again any pet with a firing point would classify you as more of a Mastermind, if that is your only source of attack.

The Carnival of Light in the Phoenix Rising
"We never lose our demons, we only learn to live above them." - The Ancient One

Avatar by lilshironeko

Lothic
Lothic's picture
Offline
Last seen: 6 months 6 days ago
kickstarter11th Anniversary Badge
Joined: 10/02/2013 - 00:27
Kiyori Anoyui wrote:
Kiyori Anoyui wrote:

Yea, that would make sense. I guess what I was talking about would be more along the lines of a mastermind. But then again any pet with a firing point would classify you as more of a Mastermind, if that is your only source of attack.

You could certainly roleplay that your "firing point pet" is like a pet that a Mastermind would have, especially if you choose to have all of your attacks focused through that pet.

But I think the important difference is that the Mastermind relies on his/her pets to be actual entities with their own powers and HPs so that they can protect the Mastermind in combat by acting as "meat shields". By keeping the "firing point pets" as simply fancy targetless animations the characters using them are technically "petless" as far a combat goes so that there's no need to worry about the ramifications of spitting HPs or worrying about those characters being more powerful than other characters that choose not to use separate pets for their powers.

Bottomline it would just make things much, much easier if firing point "pets" in CoT are treated more like the shoulder kitties of CoH than as actual pets.

CoH player from April 25, 2004 to November 30, 2012
[IMG=400x225]https://i.imgur.com/NHUthWM.jpeg[/IMG]

Kiyori Anoyui
Kiyori Anoyui's picture
Offline
Last seen: 10 months 1 week ago
kickstarter11th Anniversary Badge
Joined: 10/10/2013 - 11:03
True, Do you think these pets

True, Do you think these pets can only be a ranged firing point or can it also be a melee firing point. For example, If you are at all familiar with Dota/2, the character Lone Druid has a Panda pet that has it's own HP, which would make it a mastermind. But what if that same pet was "simply fancy targetless animations the character uses". So you have a pet that does melee attacks but is linked to your HP

Uh oh, I just realized I am treading dangerously close to pokemon here lol

The Carnival of Light in the Phoenix Rising
"We never lose our demons, we only learn to live above them." - The Ancient One

Avatar by lilshironeko

Cyclops
Cyclops's picture
Offline
Last seen: 3 years 2 months ago
11th Anniversary Badge
Joined: 04/10/2015 - 17:24
Kiyori Anoyui wrote:
Kiyori Anoyui wrote:

True, Do you think these pets can only be a ranged firing point or can it also be a melee firing point. For example, If you are at all familiar with Dota/2, the character Lone Druid has a Panda pet that has it's own HP, which would make it a mastermind. But what if that same pet was "simply fancy targetless animations the character uses". So you have a pet that does melee attacks but is linked to your HP
Uh oh, I just realized I am treading dangerously close to pokemon here lol

So you're talking about Super Strength focused thru a 3 foot tall Tannim with a red Crowbar?

The image may be fun, but I think this will be ranged only.
Physical melee attacks will be thru mastermind pets.

[img]https://s15.postimg.cc/z9bk1znkb/Black_Falcon_Sig_in_Progess.jpg[/img]

Kiyori Anoyui
Kiyori Anoyui's picture
Offline
Last seen: 10 months 1 week ago
kickstarter11th Anniversary Badge
Joined: 10/10/2013 - 11:03
Yea, that would be quite the

Yea, that would be quite the sight! But I was more intending a case where you choose to have claw melee and your cat goes up and does fury swipes etc.

Hmmm, I can see that being case though

The Carnival of Light in the Phoenix Rising
"We never lose our demons, we only learn to live above them." - The Ancient One

Avatar by lilshironeko

Cyclops
Cyclops's picture
Offline
Last seen: 3 years 2 months ago
11th Anniversary Badge
Joined: 04/10/2015 - 17:24
with a tiny genie tossing

with a tiny genie tossing fire balls, the player is still the target.
With a cat delivering claw attacks, the pet becomes the target, not the player. That's a mastermind right there.

[img]https://s15.postimg.cc/z9bk1znkb/Black_Falcon_Sig_in_Progess.jpg[/img]

Greyhawk
Greyhawk's picture
Offline
Last seen: 5 years 11 months ago
11th Anniversary Badge
Joined: 01/03/2015 - 19:17
It seems to me...maybe I'm

It seems to me...maybe I'm missing something being old and easily befuddled...that if you wanted say, a claws-based melee set that a cute catgirl sidekick employed rather than you employing it directly, the easiest solution would be make a cute catgirl character with claws-based melee and have an empty shell of a pet that looked like a big, hulking macho hero follow her around. Then use roleplay and lots of imagination to present the pet as the player and the player as the pet.

It complicates things for the player, but greatly simplifies design. Multiple people have already proposed having a player customizable pet sidekick with no powers as an ingame companion. If (big "if", I know) they decide this request is doable, then the problem solves itself with the simple application of a little roleplay.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
My author page at Amazon: https://amzn.to/2MPvkRX
My novelty shirts: https://amzn.to/31Sld32

blacke4dawn
blacke4dawn's picture
Offline
Last seen: 7 months 3 weeks ago
Joined: 03/28/2015 - 03:02
Hmm, the only situation I can

Hmm, the only situation I can imagine where melee powers would be able to use an external emanation point without it being viewed as a or in the form of a pet would be if it was done in a similar fashion to Phychic Frenzy from Esper's in Wildstar. [url=https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VKJnpbTJN1U]Best video of it that I could find[/url] .
The biggest issue with having external emanation points for melee powers is making it look good without major clipping issues. Using a pet for melee would essentially mandate that it always attacks from the side or from the back.

On another note, I would love the ability to have multiple emanation points, like say a laser barrage coming from several probes hovering around me. Think in the style of Frenzy (iirc) from Arachnos Soldier.
Or even having it (shoulder fairy, imp, demon, whatever) visually "empower" your attacks, like during the short-term +damage/to-hit buff that most damage sets had. Perhaps through it channeling on you or combining its attack with yours.

Hmm, I wonder how leech type powers (regardless of what they leech) would function with external emanation points, will it cast on both you and your target? From a mechanics point of view I know it won't make any difference but from a visual I think it would make a fairly big one.

Cyclops
Cyclops's picture
Offline
Last seen: 3 years 2 months ago
11th Anniversary Badge
Joined: 04/10/2015 - 17:24
I've seen clips of Wildstar

I've seen clips of Wildstar espers making a big ghostly hand and slapping down their enemies, That could work as it is there and gone...

[img]https://s15.postimg.cc/z9bk1znkb/Black_Falcon_Sig_in_Progess.jpg[/img]

Gangrel
Offline
Last seen: 10 hours 53 min ago
11th Anniversary Badge
Joined: 09/15/2013 - 15:14
Cyclops wrote:
Cyclops wrote:

I've seen clips of Wildstar espers making a big ghostly hand and slapping down their enemies, That could work as it is there and gone...

Most of the esper attacks are like that (as in the There and gone look). They also have ghostly swords/shurikens as well (depending on the move) and a few others IIRC

Quote:

1) I reject your reality.... and substitute my own
2) Not to be used when upset... will void warranty
3) Stoke me a clipper i will be back for dinner
4) I have seen more intelligence from an NPC AI in TR beta, than from most MMO players.

notears
notears's picture
Offline
Last seen: 1 year 7 months ago
kickstarter11th Anniversary Badge
Joined: 10/04/2013 - 17:24
so how about "pets" like

so how about "pets" like these meant for melee attacks? Like a flaming sword hovering over your shoulder post launch? Can that stuff happen eventually?

not my video just one I lke ===> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U6-SdIN0hsM

[CENTER][URL=http://www.nodiatis.com/personality.htm][IMG]http://www.nodiatis.com/pub/24.jpg[/IMG][/URL][/CENTER]

Cyclops
Cyclops's picture
Offline
Last seen: 3 years 2 months ago
11th Anniversary Badge
Joined: 04/10/2015 - 17:24
notears wrote:
notears wrote:

so how about "pets" like these meant for melee attacks? Like a flaming sword hovering over your shoulder post launch? Can that stuff happen eventually?

Well a firing point is the launch point for a ranged attack,

I doubt melee attacks of any kind will be separate from the body. Sorry.
I hope I'm wrong.

[img]https://s15.postimg.cc/z9bk1znkb/Black_Falcon_Sig_in_Progess.jpg[/img]

notears
notears's picture
Offline
Last seen: 1 year 7 months ago
kickstarter11th Anniversary Badge
Joined: 10/04/2013 - 17:24
well hopefully atleast we can

well hopefully atleast we can get them for support powers too, it could be awesome if my mad scientist could buff his team mates, fire a laser and debuff something with a laser by bringing out a high tech Ipad and ordering his ball shaped robot drone to do it

not my video just one I lke ===> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U6-SdIN0hsM

[CENTER][URL=http://www.nodiatis.com/personality.htm][IMG]http://www.nodiatis.com/pub/24.jpg[/IMG][/URL][/CENTER]

Redlynne
Redlynne's picture
Offline
Last seen: 4 months 3 days ago
kickstarter11th Anniversary Badge
Joined: 10/28/2013 - 21:15
Cyclops wrote:
Cyclops wrote:

I doubt melee attacks of any kind will be separate from the body. Sorry.
I hope I'm wrong.

I hope you're wrong too. Would be interesting to have melee ranged attacks that source from nearby your avatar ... whether that means a "companion" of some sort (as opposed to a Mastermind styled Pet) or even just psychic manifestations of your Power(s) "outside" your own body.

Cue references to Bigby's Wand of +2 Backscratching ...

[center][img=44x100]https://i.imgur.com/sMUQ928.gif[/img]
[i]Verbogeny is one of many pleasurettes afforded a creatific thinkerizer.[/i][/center]