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Please tell me about the Path System.

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Cyclops
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Please tell me about the Path System.

This question arises from this CoT interview on YouTube.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K83BGAZl-G8

The Path system was discussed here. You can start a glorious hero and become a villain. One of the choices that would determine your "path" was if a villain surrendered , would you still beat the crap outa him.

That choice brought to mind a great character concept.
Is it possible to not fully become a villain, but a vigilante, keep fighting crime, and continue to beat the villains to a bloody pulp! You won't be robbing banks at all. The consequences may be the cops and NPC heroes will come after you.

are vigilantes an option for game play? a vigilante path?

StellarAgent
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I imagine it will be

I imagine it will be something similar to what CoX had at the end, where you built up "points" towards one alignment or another. Hero -> Rogue -> Villain and vice versa, Villain -> Vigilante -> Hero. All determined by the choices you made from the ones available to you either through Conversation or Mission Choices.

Gangrel
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StellarAgent wrote:
StellarAgent wrote:

I imagine it will be something similar to what CoX had at the end, where you built up "points" towards one alignment or another. Hero -> Rogue -> Villain and vice versa, Villain -> Vigilante -> Hero. All determined by the choices you made from the ones available to you either through Conversation or Mission Choices.

From what I have gathered it isn't that clear cut.

They have said that they are planning 4 axis (I forget their names) that your choices in missions will influence. So doing X choice could result in one standing loss, whilst another one or two go up a different amount. Or at least that is what i get.

I don't see it being as simple or clear cut as City of Heroes had.

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Cyclops
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There is so much about this

There is so much about this game I still have to discover! That is the joy of all this, Its not a clone but something new and improved. Inspired by the past, but open to the future.

Tannim222
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The Path system is a type of

The Path system is a type of story designed around a theme a player decides to play throughout their levelling process. These story themes range anywhere from "Street Hero" to "World Conqueror". You can read about it from our Kickstarter update.

A seperate, but related topic is that of alignments. We have a tri-axis alignment system (more like hexagonal) of Law, Honor, and Violence. A character can be anything from Lawful, Honorable, and Non-Violent, all the way to the other extreme of Unlawful, Dishonorable, and Violent. From there we have those typical comic book character tropes of Hero, Villain, Vigilante, and Scoundrel. These labels help "color" the perception of the various NPC factions initially have of our character. You can read up on this topic from our Kickstarter updates as well.

The reason they're related is that if you're a Villain on the "World Conqueror" Path, and you change alignments throughout the game based on the decisions you make while playing and become a Hero, well that may not fit well within the World Conqueror path anymore, instead you may then access one of the hero themed paths.


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Cyclops
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THANK YOU! A link was all I

THANK YOU! A link was all I needed!
One thing about the Devs here is they are all the nicest guys and gals you could ever meet.
Again, thank you!

Lothic
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StellarAgent wrote:
StellarAgent wrote:

I imagine it will be something similar to what CoX had at the end, where you built up "points" towards one alignment or another. Hero -> Rogue -> Villain and vice versa, Villain -> Vigilante -> Hero. All determined by the choices you made from the ones available to you either through Conversation or Mission Choices.

The way CoH did this was a workable solution but clearly had its limitations. It technically allowed people to switch from "hero" to "villain" or vice-versa, but you could only do it by passing through hardwired phases (vigilante/rogue) that were so vaguely defined that often times none of the alignments really properly covered exactly what you wanted your characters to represent. Sure you could say you were a "pure" hero or villain, but when it came to anything in-between it was hard to assume that calling yourself a vigilante or rogue really fully defined exactly what you wanted. The system was simply far too arbitrary and inflexible.

Tannim222 wrote:

A seperate, but related topic is that of alignments. We have a tri-axis alignment system (more like hexagonal) of Law, Honor, and Violence. A character can be anything from Lawful, Honorable, and Non-Violent, all the way to the other extreme of Unlawful, Dishonorable, and Violent. From there we have those typical comic book character tropes of Hero, Villain, Vigilante, and Scoundrel. These labels help "color" the perception of the various NPC factions initially have of our character. You can read up on this topic from our Kickstarter updates as well.

The axis system that will be used by CoT should be able to better define exactly what kind of character you want to be. For example there's a fundamental difference between Batman (a vigilante that typically tries not to kill people) and the Punisher (a vigilante that typically kills people first before considering anything else). COT's alignment spectrum will allow us to properly describe those differences.

CoH player from April 25, 2004 to November 30, 2012

Izzy
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Lothic wrote:
Lothic wrote:

The way CoH did this was a workable solution but clearly had its limitations. It technically allowed people to switch from "hero" to "villain" or vice-versa, but you could only do it by passing through hardwired phases (vigilante/rogue) that were so vaguely defined that often times none of the alignments really properly covered exactly what you wanted your characters to represent. Sure you could say you were a "pure" hero or villain, but when it came to anything in-between it was hard to assume that calling yourself a vigilante or rogue really fully defined exactly what you wanted. The system was simply far too arbitrary and inflexible.

I dont think every player will like the fact that every action they take will eventually dictate Who They Perceived Themselves as being.

And if those PERCEPTIONS dont align of who they Should Be, they will stop playing the game. That's my reluctance in accepting this. I guess it all depends how its done. I'll wait and see how MWM plans to do this. If More like CoH/V, where you explicitly seek out to do a certain Mission to change alignments, or is it more, let the games AI determine my standing based on my semi-subconscious decisions. I dont want the CoT community to be discriminating against each other using this litmus test.

As long as there's an Option/Toggle that can be flipped between "AI Automatic" and "Manual Mission" for changing alignments... it might appease all player mentalities. :P

Tannim222
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Izzy wrote:
Izzy wrote:

I dont think every player will like the fact that every action they take will eventually dictate Who They Perceived Themselves as being.
And if those PERCEPTIONS dont align of who they Should Be, they will stop playing the game. That's my reluctance in accepting this. I guess it all depends how its done. I'll wait and see how MWM plans to do this. If More like CoH/V, where you explicitly seek out to do a certain Mission to change alignments, or is it more, let the games AI determine my standing based on my semi-subconscious decisions. I dont want the CoT community to be discriminating against each other using this litmus test.
As long as there's an Option/Toggle that can be flipped between "AI Automatic" and "Manual Mission" for changing alignments... it might appease all player mentalities. :P

Every action is a huge overstatement. There will be key-decision moments with clear indications on what choices there are and how they affect alignment. Unless a player is near a tipping point, there will be "wiggle room" for alignment affecting decisions.

Choices are part of the game, though they may not always be present in every mission, a player won't be going out of their way to do "alignment missions" to change alignments, they just play through the game. There isn't a toggle, but again, at points places where choices will be offered, detailed, and when teams are present, options for voting or abstaining toward the mission leader's preference.

So "no worrying about did every little thing I did in my mission affect how the AI in the game world views my character?" Players will know when they are making alignment choices.


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Lothic
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Izzy wrote:
Izzy wrote:

Lothic wrote:
The way CoH did this was a workable solution but clearly had its limitations. It technically allowed people to switch from "hero" to "villain" or vice-versa, but you could only do it by passing through hardwired phases (vigilante/rogue) that were so vaguely defined that often times none of the alignments really properly covered exactly what you wanted your characters to represent. Sure you could say you were a "pure" hero or villain, but when it came to anything in-between it was hard to assume that calling yourself a vigilante or rogue really fully defined exactly what you wanted. The system was simply far too arbitrary and inflexible.

I dont think every player will like the fact that every action they take will eventually dictate Who They Perceived Themselves as being.
And if those PERCEPTIONS dont align of who they Should Be, they will stop playing the game. That's my reluctance in accepting this. I guess it all depends how its done. I'll wait and see how MWM plans to do this. If More like CoH/V, where you explicitly seek out to do a certain Mission to change alignments, or is it more, let the games AI determine my standing based on my semi-subconscious decisions. I dont want the CoT community to be discriminating against each other using this litmus test.
As long as there's an Option/Toggle that can be flipped between "AI Automatic" and "Manual Mission" for changing alignments... it might appease all player mentalities. :P

Along the lines of what Tannim222 mentioned part of the beauty of the "alignment spectrum concept" is that people don't really have to worry about minor shifts the same way you do under a system like CoH that only allowed for four specific hardwired alignment positions.

Let's say for example each alignment axis in CoT is set on a scale from 1 to 100 and I have a character whose current Lawful axis is at 80. Now if I do a mission or two that shifts that alignment down to say 78 that's not really a huge fundamental change on the same order as say going all the way from "Hero" to "Vigilante" in CoH. According to Tannim222 it appears that it will be relatively easy to manage (or even avoid) these minor shifts as we choose regardless. If for some reason I'm (or you're) OCD enough to want to keep a character's Lawful value exactly at 80 (or 14 or 100, etc.) it'll be doable but the key is that those exact values (like various shades of grey) likely won't be hyper-important in the long run.

Basically the alignment spectrum will actually allow more freedom to "maneuver" or "drift" up and down the scales without real fear of making black and white binary shifts. That's a good thing.

CoH player from April 25, 2004 to November 30, 2012

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I totally forgot about the 3

I totally forgot about the 3 axis system of determining alignment, and I was even at the paragon Chat where it was explained (oy vey, old age is finally getting to me). Now that I have been reminded of it, I will chime in with my 5 cents worth and say that I like this better than CoX's version. We can finally have a 4 color hero instead of one in shades of grey.