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Mission Distances. Cellphones. Glowies.

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Ellysyn
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Mission Distances. Cellphones. Glowies.

One thing that always drove me nuts. Remember the missions in The Hollows? Here am, like what was it. Level 15? And I get a mission at the front of the zone and the waypoint is waaaaaaaaay on the other side of the map across the lvl 25 mobs. And then I complete the mission and it sends me to the other side of the map. Will mission way points and contacts be closer together or at least in a nice distance and not have you running to one corner of the map.

The other thing. Why do I always have to run all the way back. Don't we have cellphones. Can't I just call my contact and tell them the deed is done. I can understand having to run all the way back to maybe drop something off.

And lastly, glowies. So here I am running around. I battle a group of baddies and someone else just walks right up to that terminal i have to blow up. Now I have to sit there and wait for the terminal to respawn before I can finally use it. How is something like that going to be handled in terms of someone activated a glowie and it vanishes to them but not to me and I can still activate it.

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Lord Nightmare
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The third one is something I

The third one is something I need to address.
When it comes to games, you have to think of immersion and how things will affect it. For interaction objects, this seems to be where the conflict comes in. The traditional MMO would have you run around waiting to interact with EVERYTHING if it'd already been used. A few, like GW2, on the other hand have it so the interact object doesn't disappear or change after you use it. Well it does, but it's only to YOU. That specific object is unusable by you until a silent timer goes off. Same with gathering items and such.

This is fine, but it does kinda ruin the game and make it easy to abuse. There's one area in.. I believe it's the area around the Citadel of Fire... where there's cannons you have to interact with for a mission. These things are near impossible to get to without killing all the enemies around it. How is this abuseful? Well.. you could be running right behind an unteamed character, watch him do all the work and clear a path to the cannon, and right after he interacts with it, you do the same. Grats, you've abused the gracious system. Things like that cannon should have reset timers for EVERYONE, not just a single player while simple things like cages, newspaper racks, police cars, etc. should be on the GW2 system

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Darth Fez
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GFN wrote:
GFN wrote:

A few, like GW2, on the other hand have it so the interact object doesn't disappear or change after you use it. Well it does, but it's only to YOU. That specific object is unusable by you until a silent timer goes off. Same with gathering items and such.

A few of us have spoken about this and agreed that this would be the best approach. This should apply to enemies in "Kill X" missions so that anyone who helps to defeat an enemy gets credit, whether they're teamed up or not (unless there are enough mobs around so that if there are a handful of players on that mission they can complete it without having to stand around and snipe their targets as soon as they respawn).

Quote:

This is fine, but it does kinda ruin the game and make it easy to abuse. There's one area in.. I believe it's the area around the Citadel of Fire... where there's cannons you have to interact with for a mission. These things are near impossible to get to without killing all the enemies around it. How is this abuseful? Well.. you could be running right behind an unteamed character, watch him do all the work and clear a path to the cannon, and right after he interacts with it, you do the same. Grats, you've abused the gracious system. Things like that cannon should have reset timers for EVERYONE, not just a single player while simple things like cages, newspaper racks, police cars, etc. should be on the GW2 system

This approach throws up the same problem as the one mentioned above. If there are a few people in the area doing the same mission, and they clear out the enemies, one or two (or more) are going to be left holding the bag because there are no cannons with which to interact. So, there they are, twiddling their thumbs while waiting for this thing to respawn. If they're really lucky, they'll have to kill the enemies again since those have respawned before they got their turn at the cannon because, goshdarnit, they might have cheated, otherwise (or maybe gotten lucky and arrived on the scene shortly after someone else had cleared out the area). I've been there. It is in no way an amusing scenario.

In the unlikely event that this should become a problem area, I'd recommend placing such deliberately defended targets inside instances. Then everyone can be assured that if there is a slacker, at least it's someone who has been invited to join the team.

(Ultimately what you're describing here is a social issue. There will always be jerks, or people who do something and realize later that they'd taken advantage of someone else's work (I've been guilty of that, myself). While certain technical tricks can mitigate such 'abuse', they can't stop it. Best to create the game on the assumption that everyone will mostly play nice than to introduce systems that are as likely, and probably more likely, to punish normal players than they are to 'catch' or stop someone being a jerk.)

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Ellysyn
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in DCUO everyone in the

in DCUO everyone in the mission area benefits regardless in a team or not. So if someone defeats a mob, then everyone in the area gets that counted towards their own X Amount of Mobs quest. Now you aren't running around waiting for a specific ranked mob to appear. Like X amount of soldiers. and X amount of medics. and yada yada. Same goes with mob defeats. If you did enough damage then you still get loot rewarded and not suffer from the "kill steal". But you still have to do a certain percent of damage that way someone doesnt just run around tagging the mob with a kick.

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TBK
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I can tell you on number one

I can tell you on number one that the distance to mission, especially when you had to go through much higher level stuff, is something that annoyed me a lot too, and is something I'd like improved for CoT :)

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chase
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I take a different approach

I take a different approach with "distance to the mission"-

the problem is that the instance gives a better reward than the guys on the street (and are more level-balanced to us). This means that we see the door as "where things get started" and not the trip to that door. If we had more reason to take on the foes we encounter- and if we were reasonably capable at taking on those encouters- then that journey may seem less tedious and more adventurous.

Comicsluvr
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Mission distances don't have

Mission distances don't have to be PITA. One reason why the ITF was so popular? You never had to sweep for no-XP guys 4 zones away. Never had to go chasing two train stations to talk to a guy with no idea of how to answer his damned phone. You started, came back to the initial zone to level, sell etc, then off again. No pointless wastes of time.

I love Movement Powers and traveling around. You tell me my next mission in one zone (or whatever) over? Ok...no problem. I mean why HAVE Travel Powers if not to travel right? But PLEASE don't make me dash all over the place on one pointless mission after another like some errand boy in a cape.

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graff
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i would like to see some kind

i would like to see some kind of cell or pager or something from ur contact, after the first mission is completed .
its a game starting from scratch so make that part of the scratch , don't think it would be that hard to incorporate, seeing it was done in coh after ur 8th or 9th mission

Pengy
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There should be no zowies

There should be no zowies (open zone glowies). If the mission artist insists on using zowies, they should be unguarded. If they must be guarded, following someone who clears them should be a valid tactic. If the mission was supposed to be "kill 50 rodents of unusual size and come back to me", then the mission artist should damn well be honest enough to put that in the mission objective string and not try to obfuscate it behind a zowie.

Foradain
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Pengy wrote:
Pengy wrote:

There should be no zowies (open zone glowies). If the mission artist insists on using zowies, they should be unguarded. If they must be guarded, following someone who clears them should be a valid tactic. If the mission was supposed to be "kill 50 rodents of unusual size and come back to me", then the mission artist should damn well be honest enough to put that in the mission objective string and not try to obfuscate it behind a zowie.

And the respawn on the zowie should be fairly short. About enough time for someone to defeat the 50 ROUS's and catch his breath, so he doesn't have to wait very long if someone who didn't realize he was after the zowie walked up while they were agged and grabbed it. Respawn on the ROUS's should be just a bit longer, so he also has time to vacate the area before they agg on him again ^_^.

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Pengy
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That's not what I meant. If

That's not what I meant. If someone is not on my team and has no in character reason to presume I'm doing the same mission as they are, they don't know or care whether I click the zowie and they don't see it despawn in the first place. They can click it at the same time as I do or at any other time of their choosing.

Alternatively, the DCUO system Ellysyn mentioned above could be used. Instead of creating the illusion that different players happen to be in the same area for different purposes when in fact most of them are after that zowie, the game can acknowledge that the contact sent multiple people to get it, and credit everyone in the area that has the mission when it gets clicked.

There are no corporate masters forcing MWM to recreate the look and feel that pre-2004 MMOs had before CoH got instancing and mob spawning right. There should never be situations that exist just to lampshade the fact that there are more players active in the zone than there are missions, and they are in fact all there to defeat the same boss. Sequentially.

There's also no use in recreating pre-2004 kill stealing and spawn camping mechanics that only existed to enrage players and entice them into PVP. The lack of PvEvP-gated content was in my opinion the reason CoH had a friendly community in the first place.

Gangrel
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*shrugs* To be fair, I like

*shrugs* To be fair, I like how Wildstar is doing the "Kill 10 rats" style of missions.

Now granted, it *isnt* for all of those types of missions (particularly with the Click X number of items) that I had seen so far in their gameplay videos, but for the general "Kill X of Y type" missions it goes as thus.

You have a bar to fill. It could take 20 mobs, it could take 3 mobs (extreme style here), to fill it up. The amount that it fills up is apparently based on level difference between you and the mob, and how much damage you do. Also, if you are grouped up, then ALL of the group get credit for it (if they are on the same mission). There are also spin off missions from this, where if you kill (for example), a ROUS, you then have a timed challenge to kill more of that type in a set period of time. The better you do, the more of a reward you get. These ones are *purely* optional however.

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Redlynne
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Pengy wrote:
Pengy wrote:

Alternatively, the DCUO system Ellysyn mentioned above could be used. Instead of creating the illusion that different players happen to be in the same area for different purposes when in fact most of them are after that zowie, the game can acknowledge that the contact sent multiple people to get it, and credit everyone in the area that has the mission when it gets clicked.

Essentially, when the zowie gets clicked, it awards to everyone within a PBAoE radius around the zowie (Devs pick how large) rather than awarding to only the Player who clicked it. Sounds simple enough. Set the radius as being something like half a city block and requiring Line of Sight to the zowie and call it a day.


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TheMightyPaladin
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Lord Nightmare wrote:
Lord Nightmare wrote:

There's one area in.. I believe it's the area around the Citadel of Fire... where there's cannons you have to interact with for a mission. These things are near impossible to get to without killing all the enemies around it. How is this abuseful? Well.. you could be running right behind an unteamed character, watch him do all the work and clear a path to the cannon, and right after he interacts with it, you do the same. Grats, you've abused the gracious system. Things like that cannon should have reset timers for EVERYONE, not just a single player while simple things like cages, newspaper racks, police cars, etc. should be on the GW2 system

The easiest way to deal with this would be to simply never have that kind of goal in a public map instance but only on private mission maps. Make sure to have missions occure in the kind of places suited to them. If other players could easily mess you up. Don't have the mission around them.

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I am personally not a fan of

I am personally not a fan of any mission goal that can be completed by someone not on my team. Aside from the fact that it can be abused for PLing (different than farming) ....I am playing the game and don't want someone to come along and play it for me. Whether it is everyone in the area gets credit or someone else beating the foe down to 1 hp then you finish it off....I want me and my team to complete my own goals.

As far as travel distance to mission....early missions should always be close with foes that fall in a certain level range. Not only will this help new players get used to the system it will encourage alting (a specified end game strategy of the game) because vet players will want to get into the stories and missions quicker.

Zone glowies or rare mobs that spawn in one spot are rarely a good idea in a mmo. They break immersion, cause fights and upset players. The absolute worst example of this type of zone glowie was in Secret World. The Montgomery de la Roche mission arc had a section at one point where you had to align a bunch of mirrors so the light pointed the way to the next part of the mission.....problem was this was out in the open and even though you could come along and start it someone else could come along and screw it up just trying to help. It was the single most frustrating mission I ever encountered in any game ....all because anyone could come along and click one of the mirrors and mess up all your work. I guess the idea was that people would work together to solve it but in practice it was like trying to nail an egg to the wall....in the end you just cant and it makes a mess of everything. That's an extreme case but ever since seeing that I hold firm in the thought that there should be no zone glowies at all....