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Indirect Combat Powers

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Col. Kernel
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Indirect Combat Powers

First off, let me say that I believe this would only work with a power/tray system as generous as CoH's was, where I could have 10 trays out and powers in nearly every slot.

But I would like to see some... different types of powers. For example, Psionics. If I'm a Psy, why do I need LoS to my target? At least for some powers. Some sort of "Sense Mind" power should be able to tell me something about the targets on the other side of the wall, or in the other room. And some "targets" should be immune or at least have a resistance to powers like this.

Now I see two issues with my own suggestion.

The first is balance. Obviously a player picking off mobs with no chance of retaliation is unbalanced.

The second is that when on a team in CoH it was Steam Roller City 90% of the time. A power like the Sense Minds (and any others that wouldn't cause #1 above) would be largely useless on a team, but could be valuable to an individual.

Still, I'd like to see some discussion on the matter.

GhostHack
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so, you're thinking just in

so, you're thinking just in terms of "informative" side powers?

in this same category of "one off" powers.... could be something like a "luck" or "probability manipulation" that had effects like greater chance to drop better items or inspirations (or the equivalent) or the ability to "cast" inspirations on allies.

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Redlynne
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Hmmm ... interesting notion.

Hmmm ... interesting notion.

Best way that I can think of to handle any sort of "see through walls" kind of power would be to LITERALLY allow the player to SEE THROUGH WALLS in order to use it. In this case, I'm thinking that some kind of Sense Mind(s) power would involve increasing the transparency of the environment (walls, furniture, etc.) but not the Mobs within it, and that while this power was active, requirements for Line of Sight would be mitigated/negated for powers belonging to THAT powerset only (which in this case would be a Psionics powerset). That way, you don't get a wacky interaction between "I see brains!" and being able to shoot an Assault Rifle through walls and ceilings into the Mobs upstairs.

That then, in turn, leads to an interesting possibility (which would take WORK to do, but hear me out) where Phase Shifting would LITERALLY be Phase Shifting ... as in Phasing Tech implemented on the map! In *MOST* cases, when a character Phase Shifts, they "shift" into a "phase shift" map that would be pretty much identical to the one they "had" been on (so no need to COMPLETELY reinvent the wheel!) ... but which COULD have subtle and or important differences to it. Things like being able to "pass through" areas on the Phase Shifted side that you *wouldn't* be able to get through on the "normal" map. So you could create "secret entrances" and other kinds of "hidden passages" that exist only on the Phase Shifted side of a given map, and don't exist on the "normal" side of the Phase Shift.

Alternatively, you could have "spooky" sorts of maps, where the "normal" map is mostly empty ... but the Phase Shifted side of the map is "filled" with all kinds of stuff you REALLY don't want to have to tangle with! GET OUT! GET OUT! GET OUT!!!!

So conceptually speaking these kinds of options sound like they'd be fun to play with. Operationally speaking they'd just create more work for the Environment And Content Teams to have to deal with.


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Col. Kernel
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@GhostHack

Not necessarily just informational powers, although that was the initial example. In the case of Psy powers I really like Redlynne's comments.

But informational, perhaps a sense dulling power for the targets, I really like the actual phase shift power that Redlynne suggested.

Basically in CoH almost all powers were either attacks, defenses, or travel powers. I'd like to see some additional utility powers added. Some for additional information, maybe a modified travel (at the risk of leaving your team behind) or possibly with a Group component (ala Group Fly, Group TP).

GhostHack
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Oh, like the ancillary power

Oh, like the ancillary power sets that came available (where travel powers were, in COX)... but with more mechanical, non-combat effects?
apart from the "psychic" set you're envisioning.... can you think of any others?

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Tannim222
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We do have concepts for non

We do have concepts for non-combat abilties and skills planned (no promises though).


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captkurt
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you could even add powers

you could even add powers that let you "know" stuff about the mission...for example maybe you know where the certain elements of the mission are located. Like you know which room the boss/victim/glowie is located in. Maybe you know a secret way in or out (to avoid the ambushes). Maybe you get a stronger noise locator on the glowie, but dont know the exact location.

This could be a number of conceptual idea...such as detective work, prescience, plain old luck.

Other non-combat skills could be things such as better loot drops from random mobs...higher sales of loot to vendors, or cheaper prices...basically a haggler kind of skill. Maybe an inventor kind of skill for slightly better crafting ability.

I would even add the skills like Stamina, Health, Swiftness...but make the boost very minor...only for those looking to eek the last little bits of thier vitality. In CoX...those all provided just far too much of a boost, making them nearly mandatory.

Redlynne
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captkurt wrote:
captkurt wrote:

Other non-combat skills could be things such as better loot drops from random mobs...higher sales of loot to vendors, or cheaper prices...basically a haggler kind of skill. Maybe an inventor kind of skill for slightly better crafting ability.

This is basically what the Day Jobs system did in City of Heroes.

captkurt wrote:

I would even add the skills like Stamina, Health, Swiftness...but make the boost very minor...only for those looking to eek the last little bits of thier vitality. In CoX...those all provided just far too much of a boost, making them nearly mandatory.

What is this "nearly" you speak of? Stamina was ABSOLUTELY MANDATORY except for some exotic "boutique" builds that involved powersets like Electric or Kinetics that had alternative means to either boost or steal Endurance. Before Inherent Stamina the "rule" was that Life Begins At 20, thanks to Stamina.


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captkurt
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I dont agree with "absolutely

I dont agree with "absolutely mandatory" except in very limited cases...I had several 50s who never touched Stamina. But for some, I do agree with was necessary. But part of this was because they made Stamina as the power far too good...and did not properly balance the end use of the powersets.

I love to see these kinds of skills...get call on the Day Jobs...that exactly the kind of mechanic...implemented as actual powers you can take...so they would do more than the day job did.

Comicsluvr
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Psychic powers are like magic

Psychic powers are like magic...they don't have to make much sense. They can be everything from a subtle defense buff because you sense danger coming to seeing through the eyes of another. A good place to put powers that can be done but might be tough to categorize.

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Col. Kernel
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Additional powers could

Additional powers could include a "trap sense" that shows traps that would otherwise be hidden. Perhaps a danger sense that turns your character red when you're targeted.

Put in hidden doors and you can add an ability to sense them.

Enhanced sense or other tracking style ability. Make it passive (e.g. an overlay that shows your tracks so you can backtrack, or your target's tracks so you can follow them) or active (e.g. it's a click power you use at every intersection to know which way to go).

Perhaps all of those would be in a (or in different) "power pools" so they could be available to any supers concept.

As for Stamina, I made it a point to run stamina free on as many characters as possible up until they just gave it to all of us. I still wish they'd named Swift Hurtle so I could have both Hurtle and Hurdle.