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Harbor Patrol OOC

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Xselcier
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Sorry for ghosting for half a

Sorry for ghosting for half a month. Was dealing with some RL shit and had zero urge/time for RP.

Hope I haven't killed the thread...

[color=#FF7F50]Putting yourself in another persons shoes emotionally is something that everyone has to experience eventually. It's part of learning to be a human being. Roleplayers do it for fun.[/color]

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'S OK, I've been busy too.

'S OK, I've been busy too.

BTW, "autocannon" can mean a cannon with an automatic loading system (see the A-10 Warthog or any of numerous BattleTech mechs) or an unmanned (remotely operated or computer controlled) turret system. And we're the flamers by the door weapons, or people?

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*snicker* Really, really

*snicker* Really, really loudly and brightly dressed (but perfectly coordinated) flamenco dancers (including awesome hats) by the door with HUGE beating sticks of bamboo!

*grins apologetically*

*clears throat*

Carry on.

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Don't feel bad, X. January is

Don't feel bad, X. January is often a crazy month. I know it was/is for me!

Re: the disc. I'm going with it was overused and shattered. (But, really I needed some excuse to keep Ment in the picture once the Relic had been found).

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Hehehe! Nice one, X!

Hehehe! Nice one, X!

I toyed with the idea of Gayle not recognizing the time bubble at all, but she really is smarter than that. She's seen Sheena's effects often enough to recognize what the bubble is doing. Gayle has also been pulled out of time on a few occasions. Still, she has no idea how her powers could defeat that. She will now begin wracking her brain to see if there is something she or the other team members can do....

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While his symbolic

While his symbolic thaumaturgy is sound, Stingray doesn't have the mystical might needed to take down that shield. But with enough Lightning feeding into the spell stone... ^_^

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*nods* I'll try to get to it

*nods* I'll try to get to it after work tonight.

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Oh, oof, didn't realize this

Oh, oof, didn't realize this had updated. Gonna catch up and post.

An infinite number of tries doesn't mean that any one of those tries will succeed. I could flip an infinite number of pennies an infinite number of times and, barring genuine randomness, they will never come up "Waffles".

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No oxygen for the third-eye

No oxygen for the third-eye guy! If Mentalian has lungs, they will be useless at this point. Gayle has had more than enough, now that Ment is directly attacking Whipcrack. "Hamsterball of the Gods" is up next, in case he shows no reaction to the "You Take My Breath Away" maneuver. (X probably remembers this one from "A Wing and a Prayer.")

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Hope the Barrier isn't too

Hope the Barrier isn't too cheap, but it was declared before and previously established a powerful expended defense. Mentalian's TK can defend against some air attacks, he's previously denied her air shield.

Let's see what this hamsterball is about ;)

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Fair point here Des, but this

Fair point here Des, but this is an attempt at a psychic attack, not an automatic one. You're doing it again.

This one's not such a bad time, but you've gotta get out of the habit of godmoding other people's characters.

An infinite number of tries doesn't mean that any one of those tries will succeed. I could flip an infinite number of pennies an infinite number of times and, barring genuine randomness, they will never come up "Waffles".

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I can roll with this nicely,

I can roll with this nicely, taking the psychic assault and its whispers as a suggested effect of the power, especially having already noted earlier that Gayle has no resistance to mind control and hates it. It hits her right in her weakest spot. Des also gave me the flaw in Mentalian's psychic overload, too! *evil chuckle*

As noted in my post, I would like to get other characters' reactions/actions in those 10 seconds or so before I have Gayle get up and act. Ment's defense is a good one to counter Gayle's initial attack.

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Halae wrote:
Halae wrote:

Fair point here Des, but this is an attempt at a psychic attack, not an automatic one. You're doing it again.

This one's not such a bad time, but you've gotta get out of the habit of godmoding other people's characters.

In hindsight, a psionic is a pretty bad choice for a first RP: the line between the attack and the reaction is super blurry, but I try to approach it as attempting to place these thoughts, they don't automatically land.

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To clarify "reinforcements"

To clarify "reinforcements" is just setting up the way out, I don't plan on invading the thread with zombies :p That'd be so dumb.

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Well, I wonder if that roar's

Well, I wonder if that roar's going to make the heroes respond to the actual situation at hand, rather than just Mentalian.

An infinite number of tries doesn't mean that any one of those tries will succeed. I could flip an infinite number of pennies an infinite number of times and, barring genuine randomness, they will never come up "Waffles".

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Was hoping for the mid-air

Was hoping for the mid-air teleport to respond to a Gayle but this works :p

Now, to be clear, the rage amplify 1) doesn't automatically work, Scaleback could definitely have the willpower to ignore it and 2) doesn't automatically do what Mentalian wants it to ;)

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I'm going to wait for

I'm going to wait for everyone else to respond before having Scaleback move in on that psychic pressure.

An infinite number of tries doesn't mean that any one of those tries will succeed. I could flip an infinite number of pennies an infinite number of times and, barring genuine randomness, they will never come up "Waffles".

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I am reading Stingray as out

I am reading Stingray as out of the cyclone area of effect, for what it's worth.

I'm also not the slightest bit confident that Ment will stay in place long enough to be affected, given the shadow 'port he just used. :) This effect is best used in a team where Gayle can whip it up while a partner holds the target roughly in place long enough for the wind power to be overwhelming. (This is effectively an Incarnate-level hold.)

Phantom army is gone, but shields remain up on everyone but Ment, and they provide sonic protection/buffering, in case that becomes relevant.

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I mean he JUST teleported so

I mean he JUST teleported so it'd be a bit much to have him go again, I think I'll just have him fall back more. The idea was to get him out of the fight so the focus can go back on the villain who should have a name by now :)

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Dealing with riptides is good

Dealing with riptides is good practice for other sorts of fluid currents. But it wouldn't help much if he'd been in the middle instead of at the edge. ^_^

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I'm assuming the prisoners

I'm assuming the prisoners aren't in the same room, otherwise they've been in huge danger :p I'm guessing they're off-site already. Which would add tension as at least one player wants him super dead, but he can't give the location if he's a pile of guts.

But I'm hoping this'll drag out some more :)

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I do not understand "red

I do not understand "red pools" and violet light. Could you please explain what these things are?

(( LOL! I am a dog. I do not understand these human things. What ARE this? ))

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Aww, and I thought it was so

Aww, and I thought it was so cool :p

Earlier some troops got massacred by a mind-controlled heavy gunner, leaving a gory mess. So "red pools" refers to the pools of blood left over.

Mentalian's psionics are color-coded on his third eye: violet light refers to overload attacks and heavy telekinesis.

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Ah, thank you.

Ah, thank you.

I think I need an update on the villains from X before Gayle acts again. (Noted that Mentalian has already escaped the vortex.)

Also love the way Stingray used the winds for a boost. Nice!

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Kartanian wrote:
Kartanian wrote:

I think I need an update on the villains from X before Gayle acts again. (Noted that Mentalian has already escaped the vortex.)

That's what i'm waiting for too. I need to know how they respond to the rather overt threat of Scaleback all up in their business.

An infinite number of tries doesn't mean that any one of those tries will succeed. I could flip an infinite number of pennies an infinite number of times and, barring genuine randomness, they will never come up "Waffles".

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Ment's on back burner until

Ment's on back burner until the slaver is dead, captured, or exits the room.

On that note, just to clarify scale, he can hold many weapons up, but can't fire them with much accuracy: the shots will mostly be within the corridor ;p

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Xselcier, it would appear you

Xselcier, it would appear you've missed providing any sort of response to my post.

An infinite number of tries doesn't mean that any one of those tries will succeed. I could flip an infinite number of pennies an infinite number of times and, barring genuine randomness, they will never come up "Waffles".

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Hmm, yes, I can't see the

Hmm, yes, I can't see the woman getting close enough to slap Stingray without going through Scaleback unless the man is taking up her attention. I definitely didn't intend to get between them.

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Quote:
Quote:

He sprang to his feet, ready to intercept either of the Other Bad Guys if they got past Scaleback. "Getting out that way isn't going to happen, camaradas. Maybe you should tell us where you put the prisoners, get some credit with ¿los federales?

I envision it as the duo is far west, scaleback is near the center, stingray just entered the entrance to the south, and gale is center-east.

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My bad. I must've misread the

My bad. I must've misread the positioning. I thought Stingray was confronting the pair. I'll take another look.

[color=#FF7F50]Putting yourself in another persons shoes emotionally is something that everyone has to experience eventually. It's part of learning to be a human being. Roleplayers do it for fun.[/color]

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I've edited my last post to

I've edited my last post to account for Scaleback's positioning.

[color=#FF7F50]Putting yourself in another persons shoes emotionally is something that everyone has to experience eventually. It's part of learning to be a human being. Roleplayers do it for fun.[/color]

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Love the clear skilled boxing

Love the clear skilled boxing and "coming out the other side" elements, Halae! :D

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Thanks! she's not really in a

Thanks! she's not really in a healthy frame of mind right now, but I've been where Scaleback is before, and it makes you a great fighter while it lasts. Kinda sets your body into overdrive for dealing with the problem at hand, but she's going to be exhausted once this is over.

An infinite number of tries doesn't mean that any one of those tries will succeed. I could flip an infinite number of pennies an infinite number of times and, barring genuine randomness, they will never come up "Waffles".

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shrugging off the rage

shrugging off the rage impulse I guess :p

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desviper wrote:
desviper wrote:

shrugging off the rage impulse I guess :p

Not quite. This is more along the lines of a rage overload. When you hit a brain with too much of an emotion (Remember, Scaleback was hella pissed even before the rage enhancement), it starts shutting down to avoid damaging itself with all of that chemical. This is where fugure states come from, or the idea of "getting so angry you come out the other side". He hit her into such a state that while she's thinking straight again, her thought process is covered in spikes and CANNOT be moved unless she's physically restrained. She'll kill 'em, since that's the efficient way to handle things, even if it's not what she would have done normally even when super angry.

An infinite number of tries doesn't mean that any one of those tries will succeed. I could flip an infinite number of pennies an infinite number of times and, barring genuine randomness, they will never come up "Waffles".

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That is a nice thing about

That is a nice thing about psionics in RP, if you're careful the reaction can be very organic :)

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I'm assuming Whipcrack is

I'm assuming Whipcrack is behind and to the opposite side of the leader, well out of crossfire.

Details on the black spear if it matters, it's made of condensed carbon, so it's hard as diamond, but very hollow. If it missed, I'd imagine it'd lodge pretty far into the wall. If it hit, it'd probably bore a hole right through.

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Sorry for disappearing for

Sorry for disappearing for the last week. Been down with the crud.

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S'all good :)

S'all good :)

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(No subject)

[youtube]LKYrLHAsUWE[/youtube]

I thought of it first! :p

(this took way too long to edit and post)

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*waits patiently*

*waits patiently*

An infinite number of tries doesn't mean that any one of those tries will succeed. I could flip an infinite number of pennies an infinite number of times and, barring genuine randomness, they will never come up "Waffles".

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Sorry. I've had a hard time

Sorry. I've had a hard time shaking this cold.

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It's fine! Just gotta poke

It's fine! Just gotta poke the bear every once in a while to make sure things are still moving along.

For the record, the link I made in the post is for an example of what a gator sounds like growling as a mating call. Scaleback herself isn't thinking about that, and is more leaning on the kind of growling a human does when completely enraged, but channeled through a crocodilian voice box.

An infinite number of tries doesn't mean that any one of those tries will succeed. I could flip an infinite number of pennies an infinite number of times and, barring genuine randomness, they will never come up "Waffles".

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So idk how to move next, wait

So idk how to move next, wait for others to react to scale or jump on assuming she ignores the strand and successfully gets to the chronomage.

Edit: decided to play mind games again, again not assuming success. Occurs between the rifles but before scaleback reaches the two.

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Gayle gives Whipcrack her

Gayle gives Whipcrack her best shot at protection and movement.

Technically, Scaleback should be strong enough the get her claws through the protective shell of air to separate Whipcrack and the chronomage, but she'll have to catch and pin them down, first. This is like trying to grab an ice cube from a puddle of water--it just skitters away from you. Pointy claws won't help much, because the shell itself is slippery, but getting the "package" into a place where it can't go anywhere will then allow careful strength to penetrate, or brutal strength to toss it around willy nilly.

This might give Whipcrack an opportunity to do something, but with Ment's despair and lethargy attacks, that's an open question. I am not sure how much mental protection Whipcrack's psi strands provide. My impression from previous posts was that this would be substantial, but... *shrug*

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Was said "just another thing"

Was said "just another thing" implying that it's not the shield but Whipcrack's willpower shrugging it off. But Ment is clearly too confident to realize some have psi defenses ;p

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Ok, so utterly silly idea for

Yeah, due to his powers being psionic in nature, Whipcrack has psi resistance that borders on being OP.

Ok, so utterly silly idea for dealing with Ment... Scale tries to grab us again and sends us flying into him, knocking him out cold.

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*snicker* That would be

*snicker* That would be comical, all right! We don't have a super-luck hero around, do we?

BTW: X, can I quote you and share your signature? "Putting yourself in another persons shoes emotionally is something that everyone has to experience eventually. It's part of learning to be a human being. Roleplayers do it for fun." I keep thinking that this is such a neat quote. :)

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Aw shucks, yer gonna make me

Aw shucks, yer gonna make me blush. Go ahead.

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Xselcier wrote:
Xselcier wrote:

Yeah, due to his powers being psionic in nature, Whipcrack has psi resistance that borders on being OP.

Ok, so utterly silly idea for dealing with Ment... Scale tries to grab us again and sends us flying into him, knocking him out cold.

That would be comical :p

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We're in something of a

We're in something of a stalemate at this point and I'm hoping that'll get through to her... *crosses fingers*

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Oh boy, all the attention is

Oh boy, all the attention is on Ment now :p

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Well, hopefully Ment's

Well, hopefully Ment's attention isn't on Ment...

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So Stingray is inside the

So Stingray is inside the cryo chamber or escapes then attacks?

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I'm suggesting an Out-of

I'm suggesting an [b]Out-of-Character time out[/b] at this point.

[b]Problem:[/b] We have a roleplaying thread where the story has progressed from the initial setup in the harbor to the partial defeat of the chronomage's human trafficking operation, and then to a side scene, and then to the principal villain's lair. Along the way, we had a powerful villain with competing motives introduced into the hero team. The fight against the principal villain has been finished, but our extra villain is now and has been the focus of the story. Simply continuing the improv roleplay technique we have been using may push forward a potentially frustrating and pointless in-character continuation of the heroes vs. Mentalian. Instead of doing that, [b]I suggest we decide how this ends before we continue writing out the roleplay.[/b]

[b]Things we probably should include in the decision:[/b]
- Does Mentalian get to kill the chronomage as revenge for destroying the artifact thingie?
- Does Mentalian escape?
- Do any of the key villains (chronomage, his assistant) escape?
- Are the people held by the principal villain rescued, okay, and released?
- Do any heroes suffer important long term damage or effect coming out of this battle?
- Is the current scene the end of this thread? (Epilogue and wrap-up excluded.)

[b]As a way of making the decision[/b] about how this ends, I suggest the following:
1. Each player makes a suggestion in this OOC thread and we discuss those.
2. If we come to a consensus decision, great. Then we move forward and write the remaining roleplay toward that agreed-upon conclusion.
3. If we do not reach a consensus decision, Xcelsier makes the decision as the thread owner and "GM" for this story. He explains his decision and we write toward that conclusion.

[b]Remedy:[/b] While I expect that we will be comfortable coming to a decision (probably by consensus) and abiding by it, if we don't have consensus and X makes the decision, and if someone then writes a post that runs counter to that decision, then the rest of us will ignore the post, pretending it doesn't exist.

Xcelsier? It's your story. Does this work?

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My plan was to have Ment go

My plan was to have Ment go pretty hard at the mage until incapacitated unless X lets a successful killing blow in.

Forced to vote: Ment loses after a struggle, but escapes capture. Key villains are captured alive. I vote "present" on continuation of the thread past this location. I might like to change toons if so.

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In other news. that was a

In other news. that was a beautiful bit, Kart :)

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Thanks. :)

Thanks. :)

Gayle has been around since 2006 and has featured in several of my novels.

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Des: No, Stingray had gone

Des: No, Stingray had gone into that room to see about getting the people in the cryo chambers out and safe. But when the chronomancer, Whipcrack, and Scaleback came in, they didn't seem to see Stingray, so I figured he had gone behind one of the stacks of units, or behind a row of them. His experience underwater leads him to try to get vertical separation whenever possible, so he went over a stack instead of around to get a line of sight. And with Mentalian using his TK on the chronomancer, I figured he was in line enough to see from the back of the room. Then Stingray moved forward to join the others.

Kartanian: I'm going to vote with Des on this, it seems to be the best compromise. But Stingray will be pounding at Mentalian's defenses, hoping someone can get an incapacitating blow in on Ment before Stingray has to ramp up the current beyond what Ment can survive in order to protect the chronomancer.

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The TK crush is out of line

The TK crush is out of line of sight, I thought. The idea being no one can see him crushing the slaver, so they just assume by the smirk he's up to no good.

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Sorry, didn't know Mentalian

Sorry, didn't know Mentalian had other sense to target with.

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Fair point, was thinking it's

Fair point, was thinking it's more object permanence than esp :p

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I'm fine with however the

I'm fine with however the group decides to handle it. I rarely go into a scene with a specific outcome in mind.

An infinite number of tries doesn't mean that any one of those tries will succeed. I could flip an infinite number of pennies an infinite number of times and, barring genuine randomness, they will never come up "Waffles".

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So did Unknown get beamed

So did Unknown get beamed away? :p

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While the spiteful side of me

While the spiteful side of me would like to see Mentalian get arrested for all the trouble and death he has caused, I can get on board with desviper's plan of defeat and escape.

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It seems most likely that

It seems most likely that Mentalian would escape this time. We don't have the optimal power mix on this team to contain him. (See my earlier curse about teleporting villains.) Gayle has more than enough evidence to get Ment and his organization properly listed as a villain and villain group in the Titan City and federal records from here on out. She'll have to console herself with that and the (presumed) rescue of the captives and the arrest of the slaver.

Unless the chronomage guy is unusually susceptible, I would also recommend that he survives. My personal feeling is that Ment being able to target him for a new power (the TK squish) while out of sight while also maintaining the other powers and defenses he's cited is way too god-mode-ish to be fair or believable. If des was intentionally running Ment as the intended villain of the story, sure; but as a supposedly-equal player character, no.

To Halae's note about not going into a scene with a specific outcome in mind: Ordinarily, that's me, too. I find myself in an unusual case this time where a player has introduced a wild card that is (probably unintentionally) making play not all that fun for me. I am one of those old RPG purists who hates evil, dark, or "edgy" characters in a party unless all players know what's up ahead of time and agree to it. I come here for heroics, not dark motives, PvP, or angst (which is why I sometimes read the teen hero stuff, but very rarely play in it). I could see us going back and forth with Ment almost endlessly as we try to press and capture him while he finds creative uses of his powers to resist. Dragging that out would not be fun, which is why I suggested setting up a "how does this end?" direction now.

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Sorry if I made him seem so

Sorry if I made him seem so much as to make it not fun for you :( I try to balance hard enough to be a challenge to overcome, but not overly frustrating. Might be a similar problem over in Convergence....

Edit: also, I thought a TK squish was within a reasonably powerful generalized TK powerset, but I can see it being through walls to be another level.

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Splat = Spider-Man webshot to

Splat = Spider-Man webshot to the face.

Overdrive to the rescue!

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I guess he opened the door? I

I guess he opened the door? I won't feel bad about the deus ex machina escape then :p

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He's not using the escape

He's not using the escape door. He's having to take the long way through the warehouse and down the corridor. But since he's a speedster, the aforementioned 'long way' ain't exactly an impediment. :-D

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Good thing Stingray isn't

Good thing Stingray isn't relying on impact to hurt Mentalian. ^_^

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I meant the cryo door, idk

I meant the cryo door, idk this cryo apparatus is confusing me :p

Now c'mon, you've teased this "godkiller' twice ;)

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LOL! That was the tumbling

LOL! That was the tumbling cyclone that failed. Gayle couldn't catch Mentalian in it.

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O :p

O :p

Well this may drag on a bit longer then. I'll hint that he's basically out of teleports.

Edit: the shield is basically a plate of carbon fiber, light, but not sharp on the edges. It'd be like getting hit by a metal frisbee. The sword is much the same as the spear, insanely shard and hard, almost like carbon nanotube/diamond.

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The important thing here is

The important thing here is that the shield is physical, so the air bubble will help more than if it was pure energy.

I will reflect that accordingly. Thank you for the detail!

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Updated the edited

Updated the edited placeholder.

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Kartanian wrote:
Kartanian wrote:

The important thing here is that the shield is physical, so the air bubble will help more than if it was pure energy.

I will reflect that accordingly. Thank you for the detail!

Ahh, yeah, these umbral weapons are tangible, not made of dark energy :)

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https://youtu.be/krSxTXno4SU

[url=https://youtu.be/krSxTXno4SU?t=117]Like this but telekinesis :)[/url]

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I figure that with his hands

I figure that with his hands on either side of Scaleback's head, Mentalism will make a decent target. But his attack against her should go off before Stingray reaches him.

Also, with the scales, I figure a lot more power will go through Mentalian than through Scaleback.

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okay, Des, i know you're just

okay, Des, i know you're just responding to people interacting with your character, but you've gotta give other people some time to respond. We need sleep sometimes, and you wouldn't particularly like it if someone took three separate actions to try and hit your character when you can't respond, as you've done with Gayle.

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Okay, here are some

Okay, here are some assumptions on which Gayle's actions are based:

1. Ment's "blast away the debris" was a circular effect to knock the cloud of stuff surrounding him far enough away that it ceases to be a thing. This would be a good 5 meters, at least, and require what we used to know as a PBAoE telekinetic burst or sphere. That's a good way to deal with this kind of interference. While he was in the cloud, he could not visually target anything, period. That's the intent of the technique.

2. Ment can activate flying without thought as a telekinetic power. No problem there; everyone can pretty much use their movement and travel powers in conjunction with other actions, and he did it AFTER blasting away the debris.

3. Now having a clear line of sight to Gayle, the TK wave attack is an invisible, fast, cone of force. (Des' description of the wave really doesn't match what I saw in the Avengers vid, though. The mentalist there whose name I'm forgetting just uses advanced TK to simply make magic happen. Des described Ment's attack as a wave to knock Gayle up into the ceiling, instead of a grab and slam like the vid appears to show.) I'm assuming that the intended effect is a slam-and-drop, as described in his post. That means that the TK wave does knock-up, and that's it. Gayle's not losing her flight because of this, and Ment doesn't have concentration to try to grab and hold her. (see next item)

4. Scaleback's attack that disrupted Ment's movement is happening at the same time the TK wave hits Gayle.

5. Mentalian actually does take some time to recover his equilibrium from the hit and disrupted movement, putting Scaleback in position to hit Ment again AT THE SAME TIME that Ment is doing his "downward dropping monkey" maneuver. Remember, here, that Ment has to completely change his orientation in the air to control his body and hands, position himself, target Scaleback, drop his TK flight, and activate his attack power all at the same time. Tricky, given that he's just been knocked about a bit.

6. Gayle, Scaleback, Stingray, Whipcrack, and Overdrive can all move and react as quickly as Mentalian. (Caveat: Overdrive could be sipping a soda and watching Tumblr vids while all this is going on, IN ADDITION TO moving the captives. A speedster's individual hits aren't hard, but the trope works because there are a LOT of them.)

7. Stingray's attack will immediately follow Ment's new attack on Scaleback, as Fordain notes in the post.

8. Gayle's response could come at the same time that his drop attack on Scaleback occurs, but will actually happen simultaneously with Stingray's attack, because I'm seeing her as slowing up and being knocked around by the TK.

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Halae wrote:
Halae wrote:

okay, Des, i know you're just responding to people interacting with your character, but you've gotta give other people some time to respond. We need sleep sometimes, and you wouldn't particularly like it if someone took three separate actions to try and hit your character when you can't respond, as you've done with Gayle.

Good point, I'd gotten a bit exitable :p

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Taking some advice, I'll give

Taking some advice, I'll give people time to react to his incapacitation before he's whisked away.

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I can't remember if Gayle has

I can't remember if Gayle has called Whipcrack by his real name during this episode. Erring on the side of caution, I threw in "Whippy" for fun. :)

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No pressure to feed

No pressure to feed Galrithius's ego with curiosity, if no one bites he'll leave. The ghost is intangible though, so you'd need some special anti-transdimensional ghost stuff to attack him.

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Classic! :D

Classic! :D

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If you say so, I find it a

If you say so, I find it a cheap Deus Ex Machina :p

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The bad guys appearing as if

The bad guys appearing as if they have mysteriously been watching all the time, just in order to snatch the known and defeated villain from the heroes? Yeah, it is a deus ex machina AND a classic comic book trope.

EDIT: The even more classic recurring villain "escape" trope options are: (a) villain is broken out on the way to prison, or (b) villain escapes after being in prison for a short time.

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I mean I guess it can't get

I mean I guess it can't get more classic than greek theatre, good point :p

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Used sparingly, this is a

Used sparingly, this is a good thing. Nice setup for future hooks.

An infinite number of tries doesn't mean that any one of those tries will succeed. I could flip an infinite number of pennies an infinite number of times and, barring genuine randomness, they will never come up "Waffles".

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