Brand X wrote:

However, they're not Double Stuft, so they fail!

We usually buy the "classic" sized ones anyway because we like to tell ourselves it's the "healthier" alternative... lol ;)

Wolfgang8565 wrote:

Never liked Oreos but those look interesting.

Well if you don't like normal Oreos you're not going to like these either. Like I said the -only- difference here is the GoT-esque logos stamped on the cookies themselves - there's no taste difference at all.

Wolfgang8565 wrote:

I still haven't even tried the GOT wine selection...

Eh, I'll blow a few bucks on a cookie gimmick but I won't waste relatively "serious" money on something like GoT wine. I'm sure it tastes fine but you'd probably just be spending most of your money on a fancy bottle.

So we finally got our first Season 8 episode last night. We burned through the entire bag of Oreos while watching it. ;)

I obviously won't dive into the details of the episode (for those poor folks who haven't seen it yet) but pretty much as expected this episode did its best to begin to tie up many of the loose strings that have been scattered across the last seven seasons worth of shows. The only real downside to that (other than signaling the show is in fact coming to a close) is that a few plotlines got resolved super-quick. Things that might have been cool to see dealt with in an entire episode got handled in like 2 or 3 minutes of screen-time tops.

Beyond that the episode was otherwise good and it ended with an awesome mini-cliffhanger that was a perfect "bookend" to how the very first episode in Season 1 ended. It could spell the demise of one of the most long-lasting characters of the series...

Wolfgang8565 wrote:

It was great.

Spoilers*

I cringed at the part where they made out.

[img=300x300]https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CWmLWhZUEAExAE1.jpg[/img]

At least "aunt and nephew" is likely more genetically viable than "sister and brother". ;)

Well after the first two episodes of Season 8 spent time tying up loose ends and having all the main characters collectively kissing their asses goodbye in the expectation of dying at the hands of The Night King we finally had the big showdown last night in episode three. Obviously I won't describe any specific spoilers but let's say "several people died" in this episode. ;)

Ironically many of the news reports about the episode today dwelt on the fact that viewers were upset that the entire episode was all "dark and murky" and they couldn't tell what was going on from scene to scene. Really, this is what people complained about?

It's not much of a spoiler to say that the episode played out basically in real time at night. Obviously the entire episode was going to be "dark and murky" because it was happening entirely at NIGHT. The whole idea was that it was supposed to be chaotic and murky to try to give the sense that confronting The Night King was SUPPOSED to be dark and scary. Did people really think that a battle with an army of undead was going to be all bright, shiny and full of happy colorful imagery? People be cray...

Anyway this latest episode served as a great climax to the entire TV series and we can't wait for the last 3 episodes.

Wolfgang8565 wrote:

I think I held my breath this whole episode and I just came back as a ghost to share my thoughts.

I have been hearing about the whole, "thank god for Mel otherwise we couldn't see what was happening" comments and I guess I can kind of see what they mean, but this isnt any different from any show or movie that takes place at night. I liked it just how it was, and this has to be one of my favorite episodes.

Yeah it was actually a hard episode to watch because you're literally sitting there from second-to-second wondering who was going to get killed in some nasty way. I'm sure I didn't breathe at least during the last climactic 30 seconds when almost anything could have happened.

The funny thing of coruse is that with Bran being the "The Three-Eyed Raven" we're probably going to get to learn what he was doing during those last critical minutes of warging. Like he did with Hodor he probably did his "time travel" trick to manipluate the events to happen the way they did. I suppose you could just sit there calmly like Bran did when you know what's about to happen before it happens. ;)

Wolfgang8565 wrote:

I hope they do because I was wondering what he was doing this whole time. For a minute I thought he would "warg" the night dragon, but I guess his power is just over three eyed ravens.

And can I just say after this episode Arya and Melissandre are my favorite.

*** semi-spolier / semi-speculation ***

Well when you think about it Ayra has been kind of acting "Bran-ish" ever since returning to Winterfell. What I mean by that is that she seems to be operating with a level of knowledge and sophistication that could easily be explained if you assume that Bran has warged to her in the recent past and told her everything that was going to happen with the Night King. Basically she almost seems to know as much as Bran does about everything leading up to this episode's final confrontation and understands exactly what her role is. At the very least we know that Bran gave Littlefinger's Valyrian steel dagger to her so he knew she would need it to do what she ultimately did.

The interesting bit is that Melissandre also seems to be "in" on the secret and realizes that Ayra is in fact the "savior" that she's always been searching for. Like Bran and Arya she also seemed to know her "role" in the unfolding events and accepted her fate peacefully.

Wolfgang8565 wrote:

I dont know that Arya was 100% knowledgeable that she was going to do what she did in the end. If she did, I feel like she wouldve been near Bran waiting for the right moment. I think she expected to help out in the battle it wasnt until she was driven into hiding when Mel reminded her who she is and that she needed to do what she needed to do.

Yeah but remember Hodor didn't exactly know that he had been "programmed" with a mission to "hold the door" either. Perhaps Bran has learned how to "manipulate" people without completely scrambling their brains like he did with good ol' Wylis. ;)

I agree that if Ayra "consciously" knew what was going to happen she'd probably be standing right next to Bran the whole time. But like you say maybe a combination of Bran's and Mel's subtle influence "directed" her towards her fate. Remember Bran is all about people being "where they need to be at the right time". Maybe Arya needed to be in all the various places she was during the episode to finally get to the "end".

I've now started seeing fan-theories that are suggesting that Bran is actually somehow the "Big Evil" everyone should really be worried about. I guess the idea goes that if he knows the Past, Present and Future then he ought to be doing/saying things to keep all sorts of people from dying.

But I actually see his role as being the ultimate "True Neutral" character in that while he might be able to save countless people from horrible deaths he knows that were he to do that it would upset "what must be". He has to live with the tragedy of knowing the future while maintaining the willpower not to tinker with it regardless of the consequences. It'd be like knowing Hitler (or in GoT's case the Night King) was going to be the cause of millions of deaths yet not stopping him because that would alter the timeline of things that were (perhaps?) always meant to occur. It'd actually be a semi-sucky superpower from that point of view.

*** SPOILER WARNING ***
*** SPOILER WARNING ***
*** SPOILER WARNING ***

Well it took a while to mull over the events of the penultimate episode but I think I finally have my "working theory" for how the show could end.

The idea I have doesn't perfectly fit one-to-one with GoT but I think it would be awesome if the show followed the climactic template established by the classic story [url=https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Bridge_on_the_River_Kwai]The Bridge on the River Kwai[/url]. If you're unfamiliar with the book/movie then sadly most of what I'm about to say probably won't make sense to you; I'd recommend you go watch the movie (which is easily one of the greatest movies ever made) then finish reading the rest of this post. ;)

Anyway the key point where these two stories could be linked is when Tyrion has his "What have I done?" moment in terms of supporting Daenerys. His character progression is not unlike that of LtCol. Nicholson where in order to survive he had to work/collaborate with the enemy. Tyrion (like Nicholson) got so wrapped up in what he was doing that he lost sight of the truth and couldn't see the mistakes he was making until the very end. Both characters worked for tyrants (of a kind) until the last possible moment when they were (at least hopefully in Tyrion's case) able to redeem themselves.

The other characters line up roughly as follows:

[list]
[*]Davos Seaworth as Major Clipton - He's going to be one of the few survivors that gets to say "Madness!, Madness!" at the very end.
[*]Daenerys Targaryen as Colonel Saito - Now that she's fully revealed as the sadistically obsessed Targaryen "bad guy" of the story.
[*]Jon Snow as Commander Shears - The reluctant hero who both maintain "secret identities" during the course of their respective stories.
[*]Ayra Stark as Lieutenant Joyce - The young idealistic solider who might be the one to directly kill Dany while dying in the process.
[/list]

Again it's a rough fit character-wise but it would still be cool to see GoT end with everyone killing everyone else left standing. Let's face it, this is GoT afterall so we know virtually everyone's going to be dead at the end regardless. ;)

I've included the climactic scene from The Bridge on the River Kwai just to provide the overall idea here. Obviously I don't expect Tyrion to fall on a detonator to destroy a bridge but I suspect we'll see a scene at the end of GoT where all the remaining characters dramatically kill each other in an equally spectacular way...

[youtube=500x300]tRHVMi3LxZE[/youtube]

Wolfgang8565 wrote:

I was really disappointed with the episode on Sunday. I mean, we waited **SPOILERS** years to see how Cersei would die, she caused so much grief i dont care how much the writers say she came into the world with jamie and left with him. I dont buy that. She shouldve been chewed up and eaten by the dragon.

The Cersei/Jamie death scene was a bit underwhelming. Them dying together was appropriate but getting trapped under the Red Keep seemed a little anti-climactic considering everything they've been through. I don't think Cersei should have been eaten by the dragon but it might have been dramatically ironic to have seen Cersei fall to her death from a tall tower while Jamie watched her fall in helpless horror. It would have provided a poignant karmic twist to Jamie's unpunished attempted murder of Bran Stark back in the very first episode.

Wolfgang8565 wrote:

Also I dont buy that Dany would destroy the village. WHy would she burn the city before flying directly to the red keep and killing cersei. Theres so much more...im just so disappointed.

As far as Dany's final turn to the Dark Side goes I'd have to say we've seen that coming almost from the very beginning of the show. Frankly it didn't surprise me at all to see her finally "lose it" and become the psychopathic Targaryen she was destined to become. The clues for this have been dropping since season one.

Basically to begin with she's a full-blooded Targaryen. Her sadistic brother was first to have the "fever" for the Iron Throne but as soon as he was gone and she began to mature it was clear that with every success she had she was getting more and more power hungry just like her brother had been. Once she had the dragons and was leading armies she was starting to believe in her own "inevitability" and began to see herself as the "messiah" of everyone. The madness of growing more and more power-drunk kicked into high gear this season when you combined the loss of her first dragon, the distrust of the Westrosi against her (like she said herself if she can't get love from the people she'll have them fear her) and the revelation that Jon Snow has the better claim to the throne. All of these factors together have clearly driven her to the brink of insanity.

Lord Varys finally realized what Dany was going to be become and got killed for it. I think even Tyrion has known for a long time that Dany was teetering on the edge of revenge-fueled madness and was just too prideful to admit that he had lost the battle to keep her from going full Dark Side on the world.

Frankly before the end I fully expect her to yell "Burn them all!" just like her father the "Mad King" Aerys Targaryen did...

Wolfgang8565 wrote:

While I agree that she was destined to become the "Mad Queen" I don't think what happened in the last few episodes building up to it warranted her to go full Targaryen and kill innocents. I remember her locking up her dragons because they hurt a child ( I believe) in an earlier season. And now she's using her dragon to do just that. So she got rejected, by her nephew, and the townspeople are kind of iffy about her, not enough to make me buy that she would do that.

I mean, they had surrendered. They rang the bells. It's like all of a sudden she became irrational. Yeah all the stuff you mentioned was bad, but bad stuff happened before and she dealt with it. I feel like they needed one more thing, in that same episode, right after they ran the bell, to set her off. It could have been something simple. Like someone threw a spear at her last dragon, or an archer shot an arrow that almost struck her..anything

Eh, I think there have been enough "subtle hints" sprinkled throughout the whole series to "add up" to what Dany did in the last episode.

I'd agree it does seem particularly horrible that the city managed to ring the bells for surrender yet she still hit the nuke button. But I think she had already decided that she was going to smear Cersei and her realm into the dirt DESPITE herself. You could see it in Dany's eyes the moment before she took off... all the years of everything horrible that had happened to her was hyper-focused into that single moment of revenge against the entire world.

[img=500x300]https://media.zenfs.com/en/the_huffington_post_584/9ca3983dfa2a1e4ef0ad8d6c1bf49568[/img]

It's not that I think Dany is "evil" in the sense that she's always wanted to randomly kill millions of people. I think she simply snapped in face of all the shit she's lived through and decided to use the only tool she had left at her unquestioned disposal (her dragon) to vent her rage.

I suppose the real question for the final episode will be if she shows any signs of remorse for what she did. I suspect Tyrion is going to act decisively one way or the other based on that.

EDIT: Added cool .gif to show Dany at the moment she finally decided to "burn them all"...

Wolfgang8565 wrote:

It's missing the harmoniously peaceful "we surrender and don't want to die" bell sounds in the background. ;)

Perhaps the .gif is showing you her point of view where her psychopathic rage is drowning out everything else going on around her, especially the pathetic pleas for mercy in the background. ;)

In a related bit of news I'm seeing stories of where people are starting to regret naming their kids Khaleesi or Daenerys. Not sure which is worse, being "tricked" into naming your kid after an apparent villain or naming your kid based on a character from a popular TV show in the first place...

Wolfgang8565 wrote:

Lothic wrote:

Wolfgang8565 wrote:

It's missing the harmoniously peaceful "we surrender and don't want to die" bell sounds in the background. ;)

Perhaps the .gif is showing you her point of view where her psychopathic rage is drowning out everything else going on around her, especially the pathetic pleas for mercy in the background. ;)

In a related bit of news I'm seeing stories of where people are starting to regret naming their kids Khaleesi or Daenerys. Not sure which is worse, being "tricked" into naming your kid after an apparent villain or naming your kid based on a character from a popular TV show in the first place...

Then she shouldve headed for the red keep to kill who she was really angry at...maybe in gifs is the only way this episode makes sense :P

Sounds like you'd like to edit this GoT episode the same way Nixon edits Saturday morning cartoons:

[youtube=500x300]hWFVTIYRf-k[/youtube]

*** SPOILER ALERT ***

Well turns out I actually avoided this thread yesterday because we didn't see the last episode until last night. I guess we wanted Dani to live one more day... ;)

I think the overall take-away of Season 8 was that it seemed extremely rushed. They brought the entire series to a screeching halt instead of a graceful landing. It really seemed like they could have very easily fleshed out 6 to 8 more episodes to more adequately handle the many plot threads that they just abruptly dropped on the floor.

Ultimately I don't have a problem with the way they handled Dani. Basically the only question I had was not whether she'd die but who was going to kill her. It was either going to be Jon, Ayra or Tyrion. I did think it was interesting that they allowed Drogon to show enough intelligence to understand that it was the Iron Throne itself that was the physical manifestation of the "Wheel" that Dani always sought to destroy and it was cool having the dragon melt it down like the One Ring from LotR.

I also didn't mind the "CSPAN" style ending scenes. They had to show that life was going to continue somehow and showing some semi-pedestrian moments helped convey that idea. I got the feeling that some of those bits at the end likely happened a number of weeks (or even months) after Dani was killed so time had passed even though like everything else about Season 8 the entire thing seemed rushed and mishandled.

Bottomline I just think they needed more episodes to better conclude the huge story they set up over the last seven seasons. This whole thing is starting to remind me of Babylon 5. That's another example of a great series that took years to set up a grand epic story only to have the final season of the show fall completely flat with a bunch of rushed "b-material" that didn't really serve the ending of a great series.

Project_Hero wrote:

Wolfgang8565 wrote:

No, what was absurd was a finale after 8 years of following this show where they felt the need to have 10 minutes (roughly) of them discussing brothels, and coin, and repairs...

Not to mention the part where Tyrion was fixing the chairs, and the king coming in for 30 seconds and then leaving.

Political discussion is fine. But this kind of discussion for a finale? That's what I meant as just boring cspan chatter.

I found it kinda funny. And the fixing of the chairs, only to have them ruined moments later.

Not laugh out loud funny, mind, but amusing.

I think that isolated scene was actually not too bad all things considered. It showed us where many of the remaining characters ended up (Bronn as Master of Coin, Podrick apparently promoted to knighthood, etc.) and it provided the idea that Tyrion was finally going to do some good serving as "The Hand" for a good king.

Wolfgang8565 wrote:

I understand those scenes may have been necessary at some point to show they've moved on, but I guess the fact that I wasnt too happy with how everything was done and how rushed it felt, that I dont think I was ready to see those types of scenes. Like adding salt to the wound.

Im just bitter about how the character development was just watered down in the end. I understand the characters got to where they needed to be, but I wanted something more solid of how they got there. Something more satisfying.

In general I agree. What we were given almost seems like the "CliffsNotes" version of the story instead of the story itself.

Still there were a few nuggets of goodness in the episode. For instance I liked that little exchange when Samwell Tarly meekly suggested that they let the people "vote" for their king. It was funny how all the nobles responded in typical dismissive upper class "one percenter" fashion with quips like, "And should I let my horse get a vote as well?". ;)

Wolfgang8565 wrote:

Yes, there seemed to be a lot of those scenes. All that was missing was a laugh track.

[img=400x400]https://img.buzzfeed.com/buzzfeed-static/static/2017-03/25/23/asset/buzzfeed-prod-fastlane-03/sub-buzz-30898-1490500177-6.jpg[/img]

[img=400x400]http://photofunonline.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/05/5ce2ab714e987_athlyoasz9z21-png__700.jpg[/img]

Project_Hero wrote:

I'm sad to see GoT end, there's not too many fantasy shows on TV.

And fewer good ones.

There's going to be at least one spin-off prequel GoT series, but it might not start for like another year or more. At one point there were at least [b]four[/b] GoT spin-off ideas being talked about.

As a complete derail of my own thread at least [url=https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Archer_%28season_10%29]Archer 1999[/url] is starting up next week. :)

EDIT: To "re-rail" this thread back here's a screen-cap of that instant-classic scene of Dany appearing as the metaphorical "Angel of Death" after she's destroyed King's Landing. The trick to this pic is that her dragon Drogon is behind her spreading his wings - the perspective is very obviously made to look like the wings are hers...

[img=800x800]http://i67.tinypic.com/2khumr.jpg[/img]

I hope someone ends up making a high-res poster/print of this image. :)

Project_Hero wrote:

Similar wings behind character shots have been done before. It's a good shot but not revolutionary or anything, especially when the wings are added digitally after and they didn't have to set the angle or lighting or whatever to make it work.

Obviously it's not "revolutionary" but for the purposes of GoT that scene was truly the climax of Dany becoming "The Dragon" so its importance can't really be understated. I was simply "explaining" the pic for those who still haven't seen the episode.

Project_Hero wrote:

I liked the shot of Arya waking up in the destroyed city from the previous episode. Though it kinda sucks they abandoned that horse and it had no purpose or anything.

Yeah the "white horse" thing was a bit heavy on the symbolism for Arya, especially since nothing apparently came of it. I saw where people were actually speculating that Arya had died during the dragon attacks and that was some kind of "horse to heaven" kind of thing. Clearly that was -not- the case although maybe the show creators were just trying to trick us into thinking she might have died for S's and G's.