Dragonflight wrote:

The second is... I can ride the blimp? Cool! :)

You rode the Blimp? :O
I wanted to ride the blimp too. >:(
No fair! :<

Dragonflight wrote:

Don't know if it's been suggested yet, but in the case of the possible "INF" word, what if "INF" itself was an acronym?

Quote:

Considering what it can buy in-game, their society would have to have some way of recognizing these people appropriately. Or you could wind up with the hero who can live comfortably off his INF account... and can't afford a decent meal at a restaurant with regular money, and thus lives out of a cardboard box in the park.

I've No Furniture.

Cinnder wrote:

Dragonflight wrote:
Don't know if it's been suggested yet, but in the case of the possible "INF" word, what if "INF" itself was an acronym?

If only there were some way to find out if someone already suggested this...

It's Not Feasible!

GhostHack wrote:

35A
is clearer, faster, than, say:
35, +2, +3

:/

I'll compromise and try Ranks as
A = -2 Rank
B = -1 Rank
C = +0 Rank
D = +1 Rank
E = +2 Rank
etc...

so I can say:
that foe is 35E1 (a level 35 Boss.. that's +1 in Level Difference to me)

As long as A,B,C,D, etc.. stay to the simple incremental numbering, since thats Intuitive enough for ANYONE to get. ;)

Pleonast wrote:

Quote:Taking a step back for a bit, there's two major problems. (And the team obviously knows there's problems, else they wouldn't've explicitly asked for input.)
1) It's too repetitive. Of the nine grades, five of them are a "boss".
2) It's not thematically consistent. A "critter" is an animal, but a "boss" is a person.
We can improve on both of those. Instead of 1 Swarmling, 2 Critter, 3 Mob, 4 Experienced, 5 Boss, 6 Named Boss, 7 Epic Boss, 8 Monster Boss, 9 Epic Monster Boss...
An animalistic theme: 1 Swarmling, 2 Pest, 3 Varmint, 4 Critter, 5 Beast, 6 Brute, 7 Fiend, 8 Monster, 9 Behemoth/Leviathan.
A mobster theme: 1 Underling, 2 Flunkey, 3 Lackey, 4 Accomplice, 5 Boss, 6 Don, 7 Capo, 8 Kingpin, 9 Big Wig.
A cop theme: 1 Rookie, 2 Flatfoot, 3 Cop, 4 Deputy, 5 Captain, 6 Sheriff, 7 Chief, 8 Marshal, 9 Director.
A corporate theme: 1 Drudge/Peon, 2 Worker, 3 Associate, 4 Assistant, 5 Manager, 6 Boss, 7 Director, 8 Executive, 9 Chief Exceutive.
A feudal theme: 1 Slave, 2 Serf, 3 Peasant, 4 Knight, 5 Baron, 6 Count, 7 Duke, 8 King, 9 Emperor.
A "how many of them can I take on" theme: 1 Myriad, 2 Pentad, 3 Triad, 4 Duo, 5 Solo Plus, 6 Solo, 7 Team, 8 Raid, 9 World.
I'm sure others can do better, but you get the idea.

and you clearly have a GENIUS idea! it'll give the world much more depth

Darth Fez wrote:

Next suggestion: Symbolic Powers-Only Currency Keepings

Oh great, now we have to come up with explanations for R.O.C.K, P.A.P.E.R., S.C.I.S.S.O.R.S, and L.I.Z.A.R.D.

I like all the class names except Bulwark. I'd prefer:

Protector: Protection/Melee

"Bastion" would not be too bad either. Also, for enemies:

Swarmling: Good, since I'm assuming these won't ever be human.

Peon: Weaker than a standard enemy. Some kind of tiny imp, generally found in a pack. Critter's not bad either, if it's not human.

Thug: Standard Enemy

Elite or Heavy: Tougher Enemy

The rest are good. I just really don't get why Raellion means a million. Can we not just say Million? That one had no description. And I don't think I'll ever like Stars or Ingenuity. Can't Ingenuity just be Fame? Looking back through previous comments, I think I like Credit best, followed by Respect. I think Res might be confused with Rez.

Are Stars necessary, or can we just buy things through the in-game store for an actual dollar amount?

Lots of good suggestions already. Here's my two cents.

For Ingenuity:
Stars -> Reserves (as in cash reserves - this has already been mentioned)
Ingenuity -> Earnings or Juice (spendable points)
Ingenuity ->Attainment (measure of progress in leveling)

For Adventure Words
swarmlings -> assorted compound words ending in 'mite' e.g. firemite, bitemite, terrormite, venomite, hitmite, zapmite
Mob -> Recruit
Experienced -> Veteran or Pro(fessional) (I guess 'Lieutenant' is off limits...)

Rep - reputation

If I may offer a few Words to war with?

SeRBB (Serb) ~ Self Replicating Bog Being. Presumably a creation, or offshoot of the not-so-Primordial-Ooze monster, Federstrum.

Federstrum ~ A mythic creature of indescribable strength, cunning and horror, that inhabits boggy regions. Recently described as an intelligent humanoid that is half-again man height, and covered in oozing swamp matter. However, no video or documented proof of this creatures existence has been found to date.

Finster ~ Catchall name, used to describe many evil monsters, or creatures of lore, such as the Werewolf, Nessy, and so on, which certain ethnic groups relate as nightmare inducing stories told to children, that they be obedient to the parent.. Not to be confused with the Mad Dr. Arango Finster.

Tactical Unit Remote Drone (T.U.R.D.) ~ No not the biological thing! Robots (pets) that supers of both sides, use throughout the course of their daily work.

Historical Note: the T.U.R.D. units were part of my Master Minds minion sets in Coh/CoV. At the time of their introduction, they received near unanimous laughter and much virtual back slapping for creative thinking.

not a fan of Ingenuity. if the idea is to harken back to Influence to pull heart strings it just doesn't do it for me...mainly because they mean two different things. instead I would just go with something else completely. there have been a number of good suggestions in this thread alone I would go with...even if some are over used it is because they 'work' and are instantly recognizable for what they are used for by the general masses, which in turn means little to no confusion.

...and it comes to light that brand x is a thief... *hides wallet* :p

money could work, but given not all heroes work for cash it would seem we would want something a lil more generic. (suddenly I see a buncha hero's standing on corners with lil cardboard signs..."will save lives for $5"...heh)

"credit" would be my choice if I had to choose at the moment.

influence could be considered a great number of things. In CoH, as it applied to my characters it represented either actual cash or just plain influence (and/or favors). it was the generic nature in which the word influence could be used that allowed for the most flexibility in regards to character concept. using any sort of actual monetary term though becomes limiting as it doesn't have a generic/general definition but refers to a form of hard currency that one uses to buy things with. after all, not all characters are flush with cash to actually buy things, at least they aren't in concept. as such, something generic and similar to influence would seem to get one the most bang for the buck, as it were.

I can completely see were your coming from though...making the assumption that the character already had the cash in their account but opted not to use it. there for the cash drops made by NPC's would be basically overlooked. again though, what happens if the character concept is they are extremely poor, or some workin stiff by day and they don't have a nice flush bank account...because even though there are hundreds of multibillionaire heroes out there...there are still some that are just basically barely getting by. using cash kinda kills that illusion. hence my preference to stick to something generic that can cover multiple facets of acquiring goods for our characters. :)

Influence was never really money. Without becoming too technical, money is an officially sanctioned medium of exchange that a governing body has determined the value for.

Influence was more of a commodity than a form of money. It was readily available, it was traded and bartered for, it had value in the marketplace, but it was not an officially sanctioned medium of exchange.

The idea was you defeated bad guys and earned a reputation. As a result of that reputation people gave your character a certain amount of social status. Social status always confers with it some ability to influence both individuals and the public at large. You weren't sweet-talking vendors out of inventory, vendors were awarding you inventory in exchange for being associated with you in the public imagination. Similar to the dialogue in my post above.

When you completed a mission for a contact and the contact gave you influence, that meant they were telling others what you had done for them, expanding your importance in the public imagination.

That is why it was called "influence" in the first place. It was never intended to be seen the same as gold or some kind of cash. That is how it was explained in the Lore, and prior to the introduction of Wentworth's/Black Market, that was how it functioned in the game. "Infamy", naturally, worked the same way for villains. Infamy was a measure of your reputation in the Rogue Isles. A reputation that could be shared because the Rogue Isles social hierarchy was based on successful criminal ventures. If the public didn't fear you enough, Lord Recluse had little use for you, and merchants were disinclined to support your criminal activity because you could not offer them protection from other criminals.

Wentworth's/Black Market dramatically altered the role of influence/infamy. So much so that for awhile the dev team considered abandoning it entirely. Instead, they wound up shifting the meaning to "information", which I personally felt was less accurate of how the commodity functioned in the economy.

It's not money. Superheroes are not collecting fines from the enemies they defeat. A cash value might be appropriate for villains or vigilantes, but not for genuine comic book superheroes. "Credit" would be useful, because being credited with defeating a crime syndicate will earn a hero a degree of social status which easily translates into people willing to support the hero's work. "Credit" works for villains as well, for much the same reason. If a villain is credited with certain acts of villainy, they earn "street cred", and that street cred causes people to step up and support further activity, or at the very least, not to oppose the villain's plans.

But "credit" rings hollow to me. Even though it does solve many of the metaphoric problems created by a cash type reward. It works, but it feels counterintuitive. It's too easily reduced to a monetary value (as in "store credit" in the dialogue above).

I still prefer "Infatuation". It plays off the idea of both hero-worship and idolizing villains. People are infatuated with villainous characters all the time. Doctor Doom from the Fantastic Four movies has his own fan club that curses the heroes and applauds the diplomatic maneuvering of their idol. Other movie fans are infatuated with one or more member of the Fantastic Four itself. Their infatuation stems from a wide variety of reasons ranging from simple sexual attraction to feeling the character embodies some social stigma they've experienced in their own life.

So I continue to campaign for "infatuation" as the commodity of heroes and villains alike! It carries the perfect metaphor of social achievement without the vulgar associations of common currency.

You tell your fans about what a great guy I am and I'll give you this very rare Augment you've been needing to give your Evil Ninja's Katana a DoT bonus you want to call "poison".

or, if you prefer,

You tell your fans how much you appreciate me helping me track down that Evil Ninja character who is tearing up the Briggstone neighborhood and I'll give you this very rare Augment that doubles both the duration and accuracy of your favorite Hold so you can be sure he won't break free next time you capture him.

"Infatuation", the commodity every hero and villain stakes their reputation on.

That goes back to people RPing their characters not as the type to have infatuation, Grey. Just like in CoH, people didn't consider their concepts to have influence (or they did).

Why I'm not so sure it needs to be called anything but Money, Creds, Credits, or Currency. I'm actually liking the idea of calling it Currency.

One of the reasons games such as this have so much trouble with hyperinflation is because everyone thinks of the ingame economy in real world terms and the real world simply does not apply.

Technically it does not matter what you call it because regardless of what you call it never truly functions as a currency. There is no governing authority, no oversight, no regulations on how it is created, traded, and destroyed. There is no central bank, no debt system, and no way of assigning it a value except by setting what vendors offer and require. It is the opposite of a currency. It is a merchant based commodity.

The only game where it might be argued to function as a genuine currency would be Second Life because the external exchange rate gives it a fixed real world value, thus making it tangentially subject to anything that affects real world money.

Consider gold. You can use gold to trade for services and products with almost any savvy merchant, yet gold has no official value. Banks don't control it, there is only a fixed amount of it in existence, increases and decreases in supply are strictly governed by demand. Gold functions as a high-value commodity, but it is still just a commodity, not a currency.

The Euro, on the other hand, is highly regulated. The value is assigned by the EU, it is the only currency allowed to operate within the EU, the available supply is controlled through interest rates set by the EU Central Bank. The Euro is a currency, gold is a commodity, both have a market value, both can be exchanged for goods and services.

Ingame "currency" functions as a commodity with an unregulated supply. More of it is constantly being created by the system every time an enemy is defeated. Regardless of the value assigned by merchants, the value between players is determined by the constantly expanding supply, thus, once a game has been in operation for awhile, there is too much of it floating around, making it more or less worthless as a medium of exchange. It functions like rice, wheat, corn, or pork bellies with the value determined by the supply and the supply being determined by productivity.

It's not "money". It does not matter that everyone calls it that or thinks of it that way. It is nothing more than a commodity with no limits on the potential supply side.

A few days ago someone (RedLynne?) suggested not having any loot in the game at all. This would not work very well because the players still need Augments and Refinements, therefore, they must have some way to both acquire and trade them. It would be far easier to remove the ingame currency completely. No currency at all would be far more functional than no loot. It would reduce everyone to barter and would make it very difficult to use vendors for establishing a baseline value, but it would still be easier than removing loot. The advantage to removing the ingame barter commodity completely is it would take the game one step closer to having a genuine economy rather than the mess every game out there has that is referred to as an "economy" even though in a very real sense, it isn't. It is a system of rewards that have a weakly assigned barter value. It's not really an "economy" at all.

And that is also why the ingame currency has to be called something. As long as it is there and as long as it is expected to function as the means of assigning baseline barter values to virtual items in the game, it must have a name. That is one of the limits of the human mind. We must name things in order to use them.

Players can RP the game world anyway they like. That is their strength and their privilege as players. They can ignore the lore completely, they can immerse themselves in it completely, or they call fall somewhere in between. Their choices are not the real issue. The real issue is creating a coherent and cohesive game world that provides the launching platform for their choices.

As I said earlier. Calling this thing that functions like a commodity but is thought of as a currency a "Credit" solves many problems that would weaken the coherency of the game world. We can't call it "Resources" for the same reason we can't call it "Influence", both are terms specific to a singular IP (Champions Online uses "Resources", CoX used "Influence"). If those terms were standards in the gaming industry (like gold, silver, coins, stars, dollars, etc.) then we could use them, but unfortunately, they aren't. It is highly unlikely to ever become an issue, but that slim chance somebody will try to use lawyers to shut down the game over the name of the ingame commodity of exchange does exist.

"Credits" is widely used, especially in Asia, so it also skirts the legal issues.

But if the only objection to "Infatuation" is that some players will not roleplay it as "infatuation", then the same exact thing holds true for "Credits" or for any name the team finally assigns. The problem is not how players roleplay their characters. The problem is creating a cohesive game world.

It probably seems silly of me to campaign so hard over something so simple. It is. I won't deny that. Until MWM makes their choice and assigns the label, we're free to debate it and as long as we're free to debate I'm going to push for "Infatuation".

It's just who I am.

Besides, almost anything would be better than "Ingenuity". I don't know who came up with that idea, but I'm sorry, it's the worst idea I've ever heard. "Fluffy Pink Bunny Tails" would be better than "Ingenuity".

I've seen what happens when a currency doesn't carry enough "value" for Players. It happened in Diablo II. The game had a "cash" currency (denominated in Gold no less), but for the purposes of trading between Players, the value of gold was essentially "worthless" because of how easily it could be obtained. In effect, Gold wasn't [i]rare enough[/i] to function as an agreed upon unit of exchange.

So Players turned to barter, even though they had "cash" already in the game. And what currency for barter did they settle upon? The [b]Stone of Jordan[/b].

Suddenly, every item up for sale became denominated in "Stones of Jordan" (a unique Ring item). Needless to say, once the "currency" of trade became denominated by a specific (unique!) item, the rewards for DUPING that item became outrageously high, as did the incentives. Within a couple of months(!), prices for trades became so outrageously inflated (ie. [b]hundreds[/b] of Stones of Jordan per item sold!) that the economic value of the Stone of Jordan collapsed, due to what any student of currency markets would recognize ... COUNTERFEITING.

Point being, if you don't give Players *something* to use as a currency for trading actions, they'll come up with one of their own ... and it'll be one that favors the "rich" rather than being one of use to the "poor" in the community. Haves vs Have Nots.

Insight. Experience lets you learn the same moves a dozen other axe tankers use; insight helps you tweak them and make them your own. Sharing your insight with other players (via the "economy") expedites the process.

Someone probably suggested this already. I have a suspicion it was me.

Plexius wrote:

Just pick a really cool glyph and call it The Currency Formerly Known As INF. We'll call it INF for short. ;)

ROFL!!

Very naughty Necrothreadia.

So I started another thread to create a glossary of terms but since this one already exists perhaps we can get an official update. What other jargon used on these forums could benefit from having a well defined official definition. What words on the list need to be dropped (looking at you "Raellion") or updated?

Some words to define:

Game words:
Aesthetic Decoupling
Augment
Modification
Refinement

Development words:
Soon
Back-burnered
Never
Concept
Alpha
Beta
Live

I'm sure I, and others, will be back with more.

I didn't look at the dates and almost replied in necro bliss as I read the original announcement. Thankfully caught myself. Perhaps I should set a reminder to return in 4 years.