Another source of funding could be in game advertising. I'm sure someone in development had thought of it, but I've yet to see it in the forums. I know CoH played with this, and in my later months if play I still saw the Nike billboards.
So yeah, In-Game benches, billboards, buses, the places where real cities advertise, could be used to attract IRL advertisers to fund the game further.
How well would such a system both fund and advertise? Comments?
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[color=red]PR, Forum Moderator[/color]
[url=http://cityoftitans.com/forum/desvipers-creative-impulsivity]My Non-Canon Backstories[/url]
Avatar by MikeNovember
I always thought this fits a superhero game well, given they are one of the few MMO genres that can take place in this world in the present.
It never seemed to take off very well in CoX, though. I played pretty much every day (with the ads option enabled), and the only real world ad I ever saw was one for a Vin Diesel film.
Spurn all ye kindle.
having multiple and varied streams of income is always a good idea. I honestly don't think it's the possible inconvenience that others do.. we live in a wold full of marketing in ALL forms of media entertainment.
The negatives are minuscule and the benefits are potentially large and for that reason I say YNot
Crowd Control Enthusiast
I played with the ads on in CoH as well, and never saw a single ad. Even when a SG member was staring straight at one pointing it out to me, I didn't see it on my end. :(
I'd also much rather see a McDonalds fast food than a SuperDog fast food drive in. It's also a perfect way to advertise in a city environment.
I saw the CoH adds. One problem with them was they were all the same. I remember seeing the same ad five times on the same wall in Port Oaks.
I know there was much talk in the beginning on how to integrate in game ads in CoT. Among the ideas is vending machines (with adds on them) that sell inspirations. The guy on the street corner with the board ad for an energy drink really gives you a wing temp power.
I even came up with the idea of your character buying said item in a store say an I-pad and then you unlock the I-pad emote, or you buy a coke/pepsi and you unlock that emote. That would not only be a recorded buy sell record ad for the marketing it would make you an Ad as well when you use that emote.
How much of those ideas are being integrated into CoT now that i'm not involved I have no idea.
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Personal rules of good roleplay
1.) Nothing goes as planned.
2.) If it goes as planned it's not good RP
I agree that this might work well. And I'd rather the focus was on getting us a good, playable game, first and alternate revenue streams second.
Be Well!
Fireheart
i never even knew there WERE ads in CoX? But i agree, in a contemporary setting like this i feel it is a perfect way to gain additional income. Like @Brand X, I would much rather have my character drink a Coke than some made up brand, especially if it helps the game's revenue.
It's not so much that the made up brand is terrible mind you, but when you see SuperPizza "All our deliveries, in 15minutes or less with out superspeedster deliverers!" it makes you feel less super to think "Oh hey, so many supers in the world, that they can create franchises around a powerset!"
Basically "When everyone is super, no one is." :p
Also, it seems like a missed opportunity when trying to make additional funds for the game.
City setting? Take New York, map it out inch by inch, take a few creative licenses with some architecture (to add a few interesting buildings/landscapes) all those fast food places? Billboards? What have you? Nice easy way to sell advertising space without ruining immersion.
Those places don't want to advertise in a game that's basically worldwide, you create your fictional place in it's place.
Now, in a different setting I don't think this would work, I just don't want to see a McDonalds in my D&D setting, but in a modern day city? It helps create it!
As for would the company want to pay to get the advertising? I'd think they'd be missing out if they didn't take the shot. They're willing to go for the quick shots in a movie that I may or may not catch, here's a game that could reach so many!
Now, I'm not saying clutter the screen with this either, just put in some product placement. Then while the player is playing, they get those munchies, thinking on what to eat when they pass by that Jack in the Box resturaunt as they're on the way to cause/stop a robbery!
I can't.... I must not... I'm weak! Darkwing Duck! http://www.movieweb.com/dvd/DVA7ECCBuhzOEC/superhero-planet To bad I can't find a whole episode or a better clip. The world he goes to everyone a superhero, but one person! When that one civilian vanishes Darkwing gets drafted to take his place.
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Personal rules of good roleplay
1.) Nothing goes as planned.
2.) If it goes as planned it's not good RP
On the other hand there was the post that Paragon city was a holding facility for Meta beings. The Warwalls were there to keep the super powered folks IN that why you never saw kids or even a School.
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Personal rules of good roleplay
1.) Nothing goes as planned.
2.) If it goes as planned it's not good RP
I remember seeing a handful of ads in CoH like the InFront Steakhouse. Truth be told, a little bit of color splashed across the landscape can be a good thing. How many of us even SEE McD's ads on bus stations and such? If it brings in money, you can turn it off anyway and it's not super annoying I say go for it
I remember when Star Wars was cool...a long, long time ago...
A billboard for Nike Shoes in game is cool. An advertisement banner in the in-game store is cool too, especially if it is promoting the game itself. Some people might pretend it is the end of the world and demand a feature to enable/disable, but I believe multiple revenue streams is a good thing. It is the Internet and like it or not someone has to keep trying to sell something to keep the lights on and my subscription fee alone cannot pay for everything.
A message from a gold-spammer from in-game email is annoying.
Watching a commercial between load screens or some other intrusive form is a deal breaker. If I want to see advertising placement disaster I can watch HULU.
City of Gaymers
050505 thru 120112
@Segev , the business manager, in a post about revenue mentioned advertising too, which means the Team has it on mind already. In the post he suggested a sort of mini game, e.g., a McDonald's is suspect to be dealing Chaser (an in-game drug) out of the back, undercover the hero orders a specific item ( like a Dragon Big-Mac ) and this sets up a deal with the manager to bust them later. Or something like that, Segev's Lexus idea was better. Point being, he's got this idea rolling around already, which is awesome.
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[color=red]PR, Forum Moderator[/color]
[url=http://cityoftitans.com/forum/desvipers-creative-impulsivity]My Non-Canon Backstories[/url]
Avatar by MikeNovember
Indeed, it's something I've been contemplating. I would be very hesitant to suggest to a sponsor that their ad involve them in any way being the villain; that tends not to be the kind of PR for which companies are willing to pay. However, having a McDonald's be the site of a hold-up would not be out of place, especially in a crime-ridden area of the city. Being able to buy a Big Mac as a form of healing "inspiration" could be viable as well.
There are two keys, I think, to making ads work. The first is having sufficient sponsors that not every ad is the same. The second is to make sure that the ads are placed so they get seen.
To achieve both, I think, instead of selling "per view" or the like, what we want is to sell [i]location[/i]. How much more does somebody pay to get a 10 second spot on the big Times Square electronic billboards than they do to get a permanent spot on a billboard in Cuba, MO? We can fairly easily judge what places tend to have more traffic. Sponsors simply pay for the space that gets the most eyeballs.
We can also build up our desirability by having metric-measuring systems. Give you, our players, incentive to interact with the ads in some ways, from minor badge-hunting "click on 10 ads from McDonalds to get the happy meal toy of the month as a jewelry piece you can put on your avatar" to "complete this sponsored mission and some of the rewards are actually in Stars." That latter would be something MWM would get paid directly for, as we'd charge our sponsor for the Stars handed out in this fashion.
Finally, one thing I think that MMOs trying to break into sponsored material could do is learn from radio talk show hosts and DJs: when they're paid to do a spot on the air, they usually say something along the lines of, "And when you make your order/talk to the salesman/are checking out, remember to use offer code [my name] for an X% discount." If somebody clicks on or otherwise interacts with one of our sponsors' ads, we have a tab in their inventory that is a coupon book full of such offers. It's unobtrusive, since they don't have to look at it unless they want to, but it's a convenient place for them to see what our sponsors are selling that they've shown even a modicum of interest in. And then they can get discounts from the sponsor...or possibly even a kickback of Stars...if they buy something using those coupons. Again, we charge our customers for the Stars, and our customers know it was City of Titans that brought them that sale because they can see the offer code used on it.
I'm sure there's a lot more, and that all of this needs refining, but the key is to make it no more intrusive than it is in the real world, and to make voluntary interaction with it rewarding for the players. Hopefully, rewarding in fun and amusement as well as in in-game perks and rewards.
[color=#ff0000]Business Manager[/color]
[img]http://missingworldsmedia.com/images/favicon.ico[/img]
It might well be worth looking at trying to get "world wide" deals as well...
Because although the adverts might look nice for us guys over here in the EU, it would suck if the US players got all the "fringe benefits" as well (discounts/freebies)
@Segev that all sounds fantastic, really hope some of those ideas pan out, it can only HELP the game
With CoT, I'd suggest not giving the option to turn it off. :p It was an option for CoH because it didn't start off with it. Start CoT with it and leave them on all the time.
But agreed, don't clutter! However, a couple (let's just stick with) McDonald fast food places through the city and all is good!
Yeah, for the first part, a company would be reluctant to sponsor an event that has them as the bad guy. For the second, and I know i'm more tolerant than most, but i wouldn't mind load screen ads or things more obtrusive; however, i know that i'm in the minority there.
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[color=red]PR, Forum Moderator[/color]
[url=http://cityoftitans.com/forum/desvipers-creative-impulsivity]My Non-Canon Backstories[/url]
Avatar by MikeNovember
I wouldn't mind in-game advertising as long as it fits within the game world. For instance; seeing an ad for a contemporary movie on a Titan City billboard wouldn't be that immersion-breaking - the game world is a relatively contemporary setting - and one would expect to plausibly see such a movie advertisement in such a city.
One instance where it rubbed me the wrong way was in Battlefield 2142. A century and a half in the future and the billboards are advertising a movie or sneakers from the "modern era"? I thought it was pretty stupid there.
Oh, I like this idea! It would allow me to boycott Apple products in two worlds!
Yes, please.
Spurn all ye kindle.
Its up to the advertisers (the client spending money for placement) to decide what products they want to promote in the game.
The medium (CoT) will surely set the rules of engagement but when it comes to advertising "The client is always right". We can talk about wanting to attract McDonalds but who is going to be the marketing liaison who spends 8 hours a day pursuing these clients? They won't come chasing us down.. it takes work.
That being said, there are some really cool mediums that do the work for you and allow you to share in the profit with little to no actual cost.
Here's one that gives a development feature (Integrated Voice Chat): http://www.vivox.com/voiceeverywhere/monetization.html
Another client of mine uses A4G but they specialize as a mobile platform: http://www.a4g.com I suppose this could go well with the Character Creator app but to be honest I don't remember that client doing exceptionally well.
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I've digressed enough. I'll restate my positions:
1) In-Game Advertising is good. Yes please to revenue.
2) Use pre-packaged proven marketing products.. the cost (and experience curve) of building your own portfolio is simply too great and you're not in the business for that.
3) Set up the mediums in development (billboards, radio-stations, mission architect etc) that have enough traffic and some kind of interaction to count impressions vs active conversions.
Crowd Control Enthusiast
Can you turn off a billboard in real life?
Technical Director
Read enough Facebook and you have to make Sanity Checks. I guess FB is the Great Old One of the interent these days... - Beamrider
Yeah. Black paint and a friend with a cherry picker
[B]Revenge is motivation enough. At least it's honest...[/B]
Roleplayer; Esteemed Villain
[img]http://www.nodiatis.com/pub/5.jpg[/img]
No, but like mentioned, you could turn off in game ads in CoH. My thought for CoT was start with it, and don't allow it to be turned off. :p
You *had* to suggest that didn't you....
Technical Director
Read enough Facebook and you have to make Sanity Checks. I guess FB is the Great Old One of the interent these days... - Beamrider
I did. Now the real question is how do you turn it back on?
[B]Revenge is motivation enough. At least it's honest...[/B]
Roleplayer; Esteemed Villain
[img]http://www.nodiatis.com/pub/5.jpg[/img]
Having them on all the time would make more sense if I'm right in understanding that once you buy the game, there might (will?) be a way to play even while not actively subscribing. I'm not sure if that's the case though? And if so, would that mean not even active subscribers could turn them off?
I was one of the people that kept ads on in City of Heroes - but a lot of people complained about them as well.
The people here are obviously early backers- putting down actual money for a game that's *still* a year and a half off. I hope they're right and this isn't a big deal when the game starts attracting a larger audience.
If they do make ads 'always on' and they decide they're doing that early on, hopefully it'll net us a larger variety and quality of ads? (If they use fictional ads, it'd be nice to be able to click the board when you're near it to get information on the ad. So I can tell if it's just a realistic in-game ad or a real advertisement.)
J
Longtime City of Heroes player, longtime writer. :) Working in Nebraska.
COT: Mission tips writer, studying Cinema 4D animation program
The key will need to be variety. While 100 Nike ads everywhere was amusing the first time, it looks silly every time afterwards.
One thing we have considered was to open up in-game advertising to the players. Imagine Supergroup recruitment ads, or someone who is really into roleplaying being the super-trump-plaza mogul guy.
Technical Director
Read enough Facebook and you have to make Sanity Checks. I guess FB is the Great Old One of the interent these days... - Beamrider
The player made ads slipped my mind. I have a feeling (hope?) it'd make the in-game ads easier to overlook. I'm rather excited about those.
When you said that I immediately pictured a part of the city owned by Nike though.. :)
Longtime City of Heroes player, longtime writer. :) Working in Nebraska.
COT: Mission tips writer, studying Cinema 4D animation program
Allowing players to submit in-game advertising is a pretty cool idea and it has the bonus of likely being far easier to organize than getting third party businesses to jump in.
You could set it up where players could pay for two-week blocks of time and maybe have several price points depending on if they want "prime" viewing locations or just average onea. You could also encourage more people to submit ads by allowing players to vote on the best ones and giving the winner an extra two-week block of time for free or similar prize.
CoH player from April 25, 2004 to November 30, 2012
[IMG=400x225]https://i.imgur.com/NHUthWM.jpeg[/IMG]
I know that Eve Online does recruitment ads during the Eve Alliance Tournaments. I forget how much they cost for the group (pay with Plex for it I believe, as to how many PLEX per ad though I do not know), but they then get rotated around.
Sure that event is only once a year, but it *does* help for those who play the game.
CCP also have billboards in game, but they serve a slightly different purpose (they show players who have bounties on them, and how large the bounty is... so not *directly* advertising).
Of course, some of the Eve Online corps have *stunning* propaganda and advertising videos that put some stuff that is broadcast on national TV to shame.
Have both!
I would think going into the game knowing there's ads would be different than CoH were the subs didn't have it going in or even most of the game's life.
If I remember correctly, they never got more than a handful of in-game advertisers, so the same ads kept popping up again and again and again (I recall seeing all three of the billboards in the vertical stack south of the Arachnos building in Port Oakes being the same Nike ad for months, for example). Getting a wider variety of advertising bought in would alleviate the problem.
And in all fairness, having this ready from pre alpha and possibly making it non optional viewing might make it more appealing to would-be advertisers than City of Heroes could.
Longtime City of Heroes player, longtime writer. :) Working in Nebraska.
COT: Mission tips writer, studying Cinema 4D animation program
Just out of curiosity, can anyone explain why I never saw a single Nike ad, despite playing pretty much every day with the ads option enabled? Were ads assigned randomly and I just had strange luck? Or was there something that detected the fact that I am located in the UK and selected the ads (well, the one Vin Diesel film ad) based on that?
Spurn all ye kindle.
I never saw a single ad, and I kept it enabled because I wanted to support CoH and the idea of ads didn't seem out of place to me in a modern setting.
On one hand, I liked the comedic side of CoX's different restaurant franchises. I used to say to people after a mission "I'm hungry, let's get some Maj. Flanders Chicken" or what have you. On the other hand, if selling virtual billboard space in game makes MWM money enough to pay programmers and designers, etc, I'm all for it. I can honestly say that if I like CoT (and I expect to) I would actually buy products advertized therein BECAUSE I want to support the game, and I hope the people at Coca-Cola and Pepsico heard that.
I also think that everyday stuff like fastfood places, mall stores, etc would be way cool if you could click on them and either go inside and get something (like an inspiration, mission from an NPC, etc). I'm sure not all of the doors in the city will work like that, but it would be nice if some of them did.
R.S.O. of Phoenix Rising
It would be quite fortunate for there to be a crossing of in-games ads and those advertising being a natural fit for Titan City. Of course, that may be sheer luck.
I agree that I find fictional stores and such interesting. It just would be novel if some turned out to be real. (Not saying they will. Just me musing.)
I'm reminded of the 1988 song by the Beach Boys, Kokomo. When it came out, people actually tried to book flights there: until they discovered it didn't exist.
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Terlin
[color=#ff0000]The Bullpen[/color]
[img]http://missingworldsmedia.com/images/favicon.ico[/img]
I don't know if this is already in the planning, but something like a Times Square would be cool. Obvious location for ads and potential vendors associated with said ads.
Just an Idea
And a Titantron (...hehehe) just so we could one day have a moment like [url=https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EbgM3pfe5yA#t=30]THIS[/url]
[B]Revenge is motivation enough. At least it's honest...[/B]
Roleplayer; Esteemed Villain
[img]http://www.nodiatis.com/pub/5.jpg[/img]
That would be awesome. I have a feeling WWE might own the name Titantron though..
That'd be fun to have in PVP; flash a shot of the current bounty on the screen (from a couple minutes earlier, if you don't want to give away their location)..
Although getting a mission or big event from a Jumbotron sounds much cooler.
Longtime City of Heroes player, longtime writer. :) Working in Nebraska.
COT: Mission tips writer, studying Cinema 4D animation program
What they could do is put a lot of the stuff people want regular access to in this "Titan Square" area so as to draw more "foot traffic". Things like the NPC bots that do level-ups, difficulty settings, buying/selling inspirations/enhancements/salvage/recipes etc. You could even make some of the contacts shill for different advertizers. As in "Level-up Bot (TM) says: Drink Jookie, it's like an adventuring party in a can!" etc.
R.S.O. of Phoenix Rising
Only if we get to punch the contact for saying that.
Longtime City of Heroes player, longtime writer. :) Working in Nebraska.
COT: Mission tips writer, studying Cinema 4D animation program