#1. has anyone in your organization been privy to coh secret server..
#2.if private servers come alive for cov coh what will happen to cot? and what how do you think it will effect your realease?
#3. tbh im pretty upset with secret servers some of us arent computer gurus but it didnt me we loved the game anyless. i was a top farmer on freedom villians. people payeds me millions of infamy to farm for them.i would be in recluse vicorty with my ss stone brute mobing heros with me and 2 other villains. my point being it hurt to know that those who really wanted coh or cov back and claimed to be moving towards that may have been sitting back and selfishly playing without a vast amount of players. i understand why they protected it but if people would understand all we have to do is unite
bam bam the mighty ,stoned thug 187 cov freedom
#1. Was already answered. The answer was "no".
#2. No effect.
#3. Is not a question.
No I'm not a Dev, but those are the answers. Be well.
Impulse King is correct.
For both legal and technological reasons, it wouldn't have made sense for us to be involved with any servers running CoH, secret or otherwise.
Private servers will not effect our release in any way.
I played villains too. It was a good time.
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In the short window CoH was back I loved it, but it didn't diminish my excitement for CoT.
CoH is a fantastic game from 2004 that has proved to be something I will still clamor to play. I can only imagine what CoT's improvements will do to my ability to be an adult.
Whole time I was thinking "man, why can't I use this Blackwand for all my Warshade attacks!"
I mean just look at how it completes the look!
[img]https://i.ibb.co/rbMbSbc/Screen-2019-04-22-002.jpg[/img]
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I emphatically second this. I got a few hours in, had a total blast(er), and would happily continue to play if it was live still.
But my anticipation for COT remains as high as ever. In fact, in places with character creator I found myself thinking “this isn’t EXACTLY the character I want to build, but close enough.” COT will allow me to make something COH did not. That alone has me supremely excited.
If COH is somehow back while COT is live, it will change nothing for me. I’ll have two incredible superhero games to play :)
Name: Safehouse
Ranger: Gunner
Primary: Force Blast
Secondary: Atrophic Aura
Tertiary: Kinetic Melee
Travel Power: Parkour
Status: Traveling. Following rumors of a huge city in Massachusetts that is teeming with supers.
It'll be interesting to see how the whole CoH public server situation pans out. Clearly the last few days have been an absolute roller coaster of news, rumor, panic, etc. on all sides. The [url=https://massivelyop.com/2019/04/22/city-of-heroes-rogue-server-has-already-been-shut-down-under-threat-of-legal-action/]latest I just read this morning[/url] was that the guy in charge of the Discord-based CoH Test Server got spooked enough over the mere "false rumor" of a NCsoft C&D coming at him that he apparently not only unilaterally shut the server down but did a character wipe on it. Turns out NCsoft was NOT about to take any action at all and instead the various parties involved still think they can come to some accord that will keep NCsoft at bay.
Ironically the only thing that I've read that NCsoft actually seems to care about is whether or not anybody is going to try to resurrect the original character database. This would be the data that defined our original official characters from back when CoH was still operational (c. 2004-2012). Why that seems to be what NCsoft cares the most about is a bit of a mystery to me because virtually everyone seems to agree that if it takes losing our original character data as a compromise to "appease" NCsoft into letting everyone start up brand new CoH servers then so be it.
Bottomline I believe NCsoft realizes that the proverbial cat is out of the bag. If they bother to shut down any one operation another three will likely spring up in its place. Obviously time will tell.
CoH player from April 25, 2004 to November 30, 2012
[IMG=400x225]https://i.imgur.com/NHUthWM.jpeg[/IMG]
They didn't just wipe the characters, they wiped 100% of their work getting a stable server and back ups. Some trolls went on the discord and claimed to representing NCsoft and made some pretty hefty threats. Ones a clear mind would see through (such as why would a lawyer contact them in a public discord channel?), but these are people who had been up for days trying to get things working and were already afraid such legal action could take place. They panicked, really unfortunate but understandable.
As for characters, it seems the way data was formatted was that all 'characters', Player, NPC, Enemy or otherwise was all held in the same data base. The live characters were there and able to be recovered, but that included EU characters. The EU characters had to point to an EU account, the name of that account counted as personal data within the EU's GDPR. This almost stopped the project completely, but the data base was sorted well enough that all the live character data was able to be purged. If that's all NCsoft cares about, it was taken care of already due to larger fears. It would also be right for NCsoft to fear news of that getting out because even if it's just account names, that's a large data breach. One from 6 years ago. That they didn't know about until now. Because of employee theft.
All the drama however has caused somewhat of a divide in the revival efforts. I shouldn't say somewhat, there was a divide. The people who run the sub reddit and broken off into their own group, stopped linking to the discord and made their own discord channel. No real factions named yet, there's the "City of Heroes" channel and the "/r/ CityofHeroes Official Channel". The original faction is scheduled to make an official update around 8pm, but snippets from those guys are largely positive. Given that other people had downloaded the code to work on, they have been able to recover some things to get started on a new server that much more quickly. The sub reddit faction is kind of starting from square one, as of last update they can't even run around the environment locally yet. However, people are figuring out the steps quicker.
As to why it's so hard to get a server running compared to WoW or other private MMOs. Different server data is from different versions, they need to patch work and fix to get around the issues that causes. That, and the files are not being given out as freely as you would think. There's a lot of scrubbing going on to remove anything that could link back to NCsoft employees. There's also the issues that all the data bases being given out are for "Issue 25" which are changes the private server made, including the Sentinel AT. Some people are trying to roll those back to a pure Issue 24.
That's PST isn't it?
Well we are talking about people who have suddenly found themselves thrust into the roll of setting up and maintaining public MMO game servers. Like you say their "panic" was unfortunate and likely due to their general inexperience.
I wasn't fully aware that the original CoH "character database" being talked about contained all the data for both the PCs and NPCs of the game. I know the recent EU privacy laws are likely making that entire situation "extra difficult" and it explains why the NPCs were missing from some of the reported CoH baselines being talked about. It's too bad the CoH Devs decided to intermingle PC data with NPC data - in retrospect that seems like a bad decision on their part.
Sadly it doesn't surprise me to hear that people are already forming different server factions over this. While that might be helpful from the "no single target for NCsoft to kill" issue it's only going to confuse potential players who won't initially know which servers they ought to play on. What can you call "official" when you have multiple people all trying to claim that title for themselves?
Again that's going to further divide the playerbase once you have some servers running "pure" Issue 24, others running whatever people call "Issue 25" and into the future when yet others start branching off to offer their own player created updates.
CoH player from April 25, 2004 to November 30, 2012
[IMG=400x225]https://i.imgur.com/NHUthWM.jpeg[/IMG]
The debate between i24 and i25 will be a long one. I can see people wanting to remove Sentinel and the extra proliferation that was done (Such as shield and fire aura to stalkers), but some of the features are really well done.
For SCoRE's low player base they changed the market system so when you posted a recipe of any level, someone could buy that recipe at any level. (Ie: You put up a recipe at level 17, I buy the same recipe but it's level 43) The server that was up held 3k concurrent players, which is more than live and each server will need to decide if they roll that back or not.
He combined the split hero/villain instances of Ouroborus.
He 100% revamped base building into something more like Rift's system. It's kinda crazy and you can see VoDs of it on Forger90's Twitch.
Small other changes. There's a hero contact (I think in steel canyon) where no matter what you do, they die in the end and disappear. He added some code so if you redo the arc in Ouroborus you can save her and get a badge.
Beyond the i24 vs i25 debate, seeing the changes that were able to be made for i25 will lead other servers to make their own changes, and each community will need to sort out what they want.
I hope they don't do a full rollback. Ninjitsu Scrapper had me excited and I hope it stays with no issues :p
That said, still excited for CoT. CoH is the game I miss, yes, but it's not exactly going to be updated. It's more like a "Play this to pass the time until CoT is out."
Oh I'm the same. But CoT has largely been the same discussion of hopes for years, while the CoH server is a tangible thing we can talk about now. As much as my discussions have been about the CoH servers, the moment we get CoT's i0 you can be sure I'll be geeking out over that.
Oh and one last thing to mention about i25, as I would say any i24 'pure' server should keep these 2 specific changes. All micro transactions were removed and placed on "Pay 2 Win" vendors. For things like the nemesis staff and black wand, you generally get 1 option for free and the rest cost about a million inf. (So you can get Ninja Run free, but Beast Run will cost you.) The VIP sub badges were changed to be given at XP milestones past 50.
Yeah some of the SCORE server changes I've read about are pretty interesting - especially the way he handled the Cash Store/Vet Reward stuff. I can't think of a better way to handle it. Though he could have named it a bit less "Tounge-in cheek" - maybe "Veteran/VIP Vendor" would be better.
I actually don't mind the concept of the Sentinel AT - I'd like to try it out and compare it to Blasters and Corruptors. And power proliferation - as long as it makes sense and doesn't unbalance things too much, I'm all for it.
I don't mind the basic idea of people adding things to the original CoH baseline. My point was that when there's say a dozen big public CoH servers up and running they're each going to start having their own unique mixes of content (like the "Sentinel AT") so if you want to enjoy ALL the various new things you're going to have to decide how many DIFFERENT servers you're going to want to play on. I simply see the whole thing becoming pretty messy and chaotic in a few years which I suppose is both a blessing and a curse combined.
CoH player from April 25, 2004 to November 30, 2012
[IMG=400x225]https://i.imgur.com/NHUthWM.jpeg[/IMG]
I have hope that we will be able to exist on a large server (or a handful of big ones) rather than a diaspora.
According to Tony V on twitter, "The Titan Network is in talks with NCSoft regarding a community-run City of Heroes server." Even if the talks go nowhere there will still be servers out there. I guess NCSoft realized the cat was out of the bag with the release of the code? Will be interesting to see what they have to say.
Kinda reminds me of Jedi Academy private servers with nonsense rules I hated :p Part of Force Mod whatever was that only the tip of the saber did damage, trying to mimic a sword or something.
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Avatar by MikeNovember
[url=https://cityoftitans.com/comment/170506#comment-170506]Bottomline I believe NCsoft realizes that the proverbial cat is out of the bag.[/url] ;)
CoH player from April 25, 2004 to November 30, 2012
[IMG=400x225]https://i.imgur.com/NHUthWM.jpeg[/IMG]
This is a bit of a tangent, but [url=https://grrlpowercomic.com/archives/comic/grrl-power-719-idiomatic-planetary/]Panel Three.[/url] And that I didn't link directly to the image may be taken as a NSFW warning, if you like. ^_-
Foradain, Mage of Phoenix Rising.
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https://massivelyop.com/2019/04/23/the-titan-network-is-negotiating-to-open-a-legal-community-run-city-of-heroes-server/
Wonder if this would ease the copyright name/likeness stalking if it were ran in this manner? If by non-profit they mean not profiting from it. This was simply a random thought I had watching some toons from recent CoH videos. Man, that sounds crazy, RECENT CoH videos..
https://massivelyop.com/2019/04/22/pirates-of-the-burning-seas-new-owners-aim-to-revitalize-the-game-after-rescuing-it-from-certain-doom/
Looking to play this game, never got a chance. So essentially, I have a brand new superhero game to play, if all things go according to their plans.
As a child, I thought my name was handsome, cause that is what everyone called me.
With all the.....intrigue. I wonder how they'll maintain this non-profit-ness :p
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Avatar by MikeNovember
A sword is a long, thin bar of metal... every part of it can do damage. Heck, you could crush someone's skull by hitting him with the pommel. What I meant to say is, that mod is dumb.
[url=https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W_HUdf89hI8]Send out your signal, call in your hero
I kidnapped his lady, now his power's are zero.
[/url]
I think he meant fencing, a fencing rapier doesn't do much unless it's the tip.
But it's a light sabre, not a light rapier....
Foradain, Mage of Phoenix Rising.
[url=https://cityoftitans.com/forum/foradains-character-conclave]Foradain's Character Conclave[/url]
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The sentinel at is actually pretty well balanced believe it or not. The defenses are moderate enough not to impinge on scrappers and the loss of some of the blaster support powers offsets things well.
I'm pretty certain most of the power proliferations were at least planned for, but I could be wrong there.
As to Titan network being in talks with ncsoft, I'm withholding any opinion. We've heard that statement before. At least one of those was (from all appearances) simply a smokescreen to protect the original secret server cabal.
Is it on the up and up now? Who knows? Nothing we can really do but wait and see.
And dream of CoT goodness to come.
Leandro helped out setting up another i25 server. People are crushing it and the account page to death right now. Due to the last server wipe they have to make new game accounts .
This is different from the group still trying to get i24 servers up, they are making progress but still.
I agree with the people saying the work Leo and company did was pretty great. I'm not happy they kept it a secret, and current events show progress can be made much more rapidly with a more open approach since there are plenty of knowledgeable and talented people willing to help. Despite the past, the work they did seems like a nice improvement.
I only took Physics I, but the fulcrum of a sword means the furthest point applies more force than the blade near the hilt.
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Avatar by MikeNovember
Much of how any sword works is whether it's mainly designed to be swung (i.e. saber) or thrusted at someone (i.e. rapier). Two completely different "applications" of physics going on there. Then again I guess you could take any sword and [i]throw[/i] it at someone and if the hilt/pommel hits them up side the head it probably still wouldn't feel too good regardless. ;)
CoH player from April 25, 2004 to November 30, 2012
[IMG=400x225]https://i.imgur.com/NHUthWM.jpeg[/IMG]
If I remember correctly from Shadiversity the best "[b]cutting point[/b]" on a sword was two thirds up the blade, but I think that also took accuracy into account.
That is what my Japanese sword instructor told be as well the last 1/3 of the sword for strikes and the lower 2/3 for blocking.
Again what you guys are saying here only applies to swords designed to be "swung" at people to cut them. Your statements don't really apply to [url=https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Foil_%28fencing%29]rapier/foil/épée[/url] type swords that are primarily designed to "poke" people.
Apparently the Jedi Academy private servers that DesViper originally mentioned wanted lightsabers to act like fencing swords instead of full-bladed "cutting" swords.
CoH player from April 25, 2004 to November 30, 2012
[IMG=400x225]https://i.imgur.com/NHUthWM.jpeg[/IMG]
Point being, a lightsaber is not a sword, it's essentially a finite laser. So where one meets the blade is not a factor in how much of your arm you lose :p
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Avatar by MikeNovember
When you're talking lightsabers (which as far as we know unfortunately can't exist based on real world physics) the ideas of the "best cutting point being two thirds up the blade" or "the last 1/3 of the sword for strikes and the lower 2/3 for blocking" don't strictly apply because those concepts assume your sword is made of edged metal and not some kind of weightless "static plasma" or whatever technobabble they're currently using.
A theoretical lightsaber's "best cutting surface" is going to be equally effective on 100% of its outer surface, not just on a small region of a single bladed edge. TBH a lightsaber from a martial arts point view is probably closer to a bō stick and/or quarterstaff because ANY portion of its length can be equally used in offensive or defensive contact. There's no one "strong point" of a lightsaber that would apply to the things Kazander and blacke4dawn were saying.
CoH player from April 25, 2004 to November 30, 2012
[IMG=400x225]https://i.imgur.com/NHUthWM.jpeg[/IMG]
Yeah but staffs are still bound by physics, so the further third is still a better striking force.
Anywho, I agree that the wild wild west of private CoH servers is going to be..............interesting :p
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I only used the example of a staff simply because that was the closest "real world" equivalent to what a lightsaber could do do in terms of its surface area being equally capable of both offensive and defensive contact. A lightsaber is not really a "bladed" weapon - it's more like a sci-fi police baton made of hot plasma.
As far as "striking force physics" goes what does that matter when a lightsaber's so-called blade could effortlessly cut through almost anything like a hot knife through butter? Like I said all the "traditional" ideas about the forces involved with a long metallic cutting blade (or even a staff) get thrown out the window when you try to apply it to something semi-magical like a lightsaber.
Yeah I figure there'll be a bunch of people at first who'll "experiment" with the idea of tossing up a server but then eventually it might boil back down to perhaps 2 or 3 main factions. I'm sure the original SCORE folks will be at least one of those groups.
The key will be that no matter how many public CoH servers there are they each will start offering their own unique options and server configurations (i.e. pure Issue 24, Issue 25, Issue 25+, etc.). It'll be like [url=https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Darwin%27s_finches]Darwin's finches[/url] - MMO evolution in real time. ;)
CoH player from April 25, 2004 to November 30, 2012
[IMG=400x225]https://i.imgur.com/NHUthWM.jpeg[/IMG]
I'm totally down with watching CoH progress in real time. The speed with which the community has picked up the torch and talented people have been making progress has been really impressive. While there may be a few different main server factions there will likely be a lot of collaboration if someone makes new zones, powers, bugfixes, etc. While it is possible people would keep work like that for themselves, and have in the past, the general trend now is to work together and share everything. Lots of open source projects end up with a ton of forked versions but they almost always end up with one (or very few) "main" versions that everyone agrees has the best stuff. It would be great to see CoX end up like this, we could have ongoing improvements for many years.
One really good example of this is dungeon crawl stone soup, so named because the open source development strategy follows the stone soup fable.
A reason for Lightsabres to not care where they strike, is that their blade is anecdotally 'mass-less', so questions of leverage and striking force do not apply.
I've always thought Lightsabres were force-field technology, rather than plasma or laser.
Be Well!
Fireheart
I'm sure having several groups working on maintaining CoH will be better for everyone than having a single secret cabal keeping the game isolated to a select minority. It's also possible that the various CoH factions will share improvements with each other, but to be fair there's no guarantee/requirement for that to happen in any/all cases. In the long run I predict we'll have a mix of shared improvements as well as unique features amongst the various servers.
TBH what's more important than "who has what updated features" is exactly how RELIABLE a given CoH server is going to be. I get that it might be cool to play with new "Issue 25" ATs or missions but if Joe Blow can't keep his server up and running pretty much 24/7 or closes it down for a week or two every month then the whole thing is going to be pointless. Frankly If I don't get the feeling that any specific CoH server faction is going to be able to provide reliably long term service then I'm not going to want to invest any serious time trying to level up characters again.
CoH player from April 25, 2004 to November 30, 2012
[IMG=400x225]https://i.imgur.com/NHUthWM.jpeg[/IMG]
Plasma within a static containment force field has my vote. ;)
The very question of this underlines the point for why trying to apply "real world" blade physics to lightsabers is semi-pointless. If the fandom can't even settle on what sci-fi technobabble properly "explains" what makes a lightsaber work then how can we even begin to apply real world sword mechanics to them? ;)
CoH player from April 25, 2004 to November 30, 2012
[IMG=400x225]https://i.imgur.com/NHUthWM.jpeg[/IMG]
Word
I cannot find the topic, but awhile back, I stated that we may be playing 3 superhero mmo at some point, City of Heroes, Ship of heroes, & City of Titans. I figured one way or another, NC could not stand back while these successors build up superhero mmo. For them to hold on to this IP for so long, something always struck me as odd. CoX was making money, which was also odd.
As a child, I thought my name was handsome, cause that is what everyone called me.
Everything that NCsoft did in relation to CoH was "odd". First they knee-capped a profitable MMO then they just sat on the IP for years doing nothing with it letting its value fade to relative zip. It was a total "lose-lose" for them.
I suppose NCsoft will have to decide to look stupid if some of these new CoH servers start to figure out how to make money off of this. The longer NCsoft does nothing about any of this the weaker their case will get.
CoH player from April 25, 2004 to November 30, 2012
[IMG=400x225]https://i.imgur.com/NHUthWM.jpeg[/IMG]
The ongoing situation is odd from all sorts of angles, and also perhaps a bit ahead of its time.
Many shrugging bystanders may change their tune if, say, Steam gets bought out and starts charging by the hour, for example.
IP ownership, or at least attitudes about IP ownership, may be in for a few changes.
Quidquid latine dictum sit, altum viditur.
https://newzoo.com/insights/rankings/top-25-companies-game-revenues/
NCSOFT is fairly profitable, I would not be shocked if something CoH related were released at some point. Maybe that explains their will to hold on; perhaps they were planning to use it. Funny all this drama emerged during Marvel Avengers Endgame release.
As a child, I thought my name was handsome, cause that is what everyone called me.
NCsoft has already said that they have absolutely no long term plans to release anything like a sequel to CoH or anything of the kind.
As far as "reusing" any individual parts from the IP itself they have already used Statesman as one of the characters in their very ill-fated "[url=https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Master_X_Master]Master X Master[/url]" MOBA game that was apparently so bad it only lasted like 6 months before it was shutdown.
So it seems NCsoft just wanted to hang onto the CoH IP to proverbially "strip it for parts" and so far that's been a complete disaster for them.
CoH player from April 25, 2004 to November 30, 2012
[IMG=400x225]https://i.imgur.com/NHUthWM.jpeg[/IMG]
This is actually a kind of exciting prospect. Which modern advancements will these Finch Servers choose in order to help them adapt to their new strange ecosystem? I was only interested in a detached manner but now I'm feeling all naturalist game designer about it. Need to dig up my binoculars and keep an eye on these developments.
Poetic way to put btw. Best thing I've read all week.
Thanks. The Darwin Finch thing was a useful analogy to this server situation but to be honest I think the different CoH "factions" have the more negative potential to start splitting into their own competing denominations like they did in Life of Brian:
[youtube=500x300]Ka9mfZbTFbk[/youtube]
Time will tell of course.
CoH player from April 25, 2004 to November 30, 2012
[IMG=400x225]https://i.imgur.com/NHUthWM.jpeg[/IMG]
They also said CoH was shutting down; fast forward years later, in negotiations for a private server. Whether they say yes or no is another story.
I have learned to take everything a business says with a grain of salt. They follow the money trail, not their word. Fallout 76 micro-transactions , Ark optimization, Phoenix Point to name a few..
As a child, I thought my name was handsome, cause that is what everyone called me.
Phoenix Point? Oh you mean the Epic thing? Ehh, it's hard to turn down the kind of scratch that Epic is throwing around.
To be fair they really had no choice in the matter. NCsoft is currently in "negotiations over private servers" because those servers -already- exist, not because they unilaterally changed their minds and decided to be nice enough to give them to us. I'm sure if the SCORE thing didn't happen neither would have NCsoft's desire to be in any "negotiations" over this at all.
NCsoft didn't make any previous deals related to CoH because they thought they would never HAVE to. With the cat already out of the bag the only reason they've come to the negotiating table now is because they were forced to save face.
Sure it's practical to be a bit cynical when it comes to companies and their desire to make money. Perhaps NCsoft sees a new way to license the CoH IP to make new money from it. Who knows...
All I know for sure is that after so many years -and- the Master X Master debacle they were probably in zero mood to do -anything- else with the IP. Without the SCORE implosion I'm quite sure NCsoft would have continued pretending CoH never even existed.
CoH player from April 25, 2004 to November 30, 2012
[IMG=400x225]https://i.imgur.com/NHUthWM.jpeg[/IMG]
I'm just happy the game code is out there for folks to enjoy. It's seems wasteful not to let the public take over fostering the game if NC Soft is just sitting on the code like some dragon hoarding gold.
I hope it turns out well and people are able to create stable, supportive gaming from it.
The problem is that NCSoft hasn't responded to any overture.
It is very likely that they are preparing a lawsuit claiming that the code was illegally appropriated and is planning not just a C&D but to sue for IP theft as well as damages.
It is what they have done in the past and is the most likely scenario at this point.
It's certainly the most likely scenario [b]IF[/b] they actually wanted to defend their rights to this particular IP. I still believe that "if" is a pretty big one at this point.
NCsoft could have easily started tossing C&Ds left and right by now, again if they wanted to. They wouldn't have to wait this long to react even if their initial reaction was limited/preliminary.
At this point it's simply too early to tell one way or the other what NCsoft's true intentions are. They certainly could be holding back quietly for a few weeks to assess the situation and maybe we'll see them start to unload all their legal guns very soon. On the other hand one could easily argue that if they were -actually- serious about defending this IP they would have reasonably done "something" by now.
CoH player from April 25, 2004 to November 30, 2012
[IMG=400x225]https://i.imgur.com/NHUthWM.jpeg[/IMG]
Eh, I have trouble believing this. A lawsuit costs money to initiate and they’re suing someone who probably doesn’t have very much money. A lawsuit would probably have the net effect of being a donation to their lawyers. I imagine they like money too much to just sue on principle when they have little chance of actually getting anything.
If they just want to kill the servers a C&D would do the job and I’m sure is much cheaper.
My understanding is that the code was leaked. They may be pursuing that(those) individual(s). The wheels may be turning but not visible to the outside. The code is in the wild and will be hard to pin down now. But, if NCsoft leverages the full wrath of the law, they could lay down a terrifying swath of lawsuits to deter future offenders. In the US crimes involving the use of a computer can be punished quite severely. If you use a computer to steal a soda from a 7/11 you could find yourself in jail for years vs if you get caught walking out without paying for the same item. (IANAL and there are many factors involved) Frankly what's going on is equivalent to joy riding in a stolen car (with a computer). Will they charge everyone that "rides along?" Probably not, considering there seems to be about 10k(EG) people involved. But they could take a book from the US's music association that sent threatening letters to all the users once they get a hold of the databases in the hopes that a fraction will pay out in order to settle. Mostly that sort of legal action has faded out but this case is a little different since they will have more detailed information about the individuals.
You can do as you will but until there is an official statement from NCsoft that says they release the IP and will not pursue legal action against the servers I'm not going to touch them with a 10ft pole.
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Why do you think MWM is telling our people to not go near this with ANY length pole!
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[color=#FF0000]Senior Developer/Project Manager/Co-Founder... and then some.[/color]
Leave the length of my pole out of it.
[color=red]PR Team, Forum Moderator, Live Response Team[/color]
I will start this post by agreeing that everything you've said here about what NCsoft -might- do in response to this issue is completely plausible. I'm not denying that NCsoft could in fact fire off all sorts of C&Ds and/or lawsuits and things could get very ugly. Frankly just like you at least part of the reason I have not started playing CoH again is that I'm waiting to see what (if anything) NCsoft is going to do about this situation.
But in the classic spirit of Devil's Advocacy I'd like to establish a case for why in the greater scheme of things I actually do -not- believe NCsoft is currently planning to defend their claims to the CoH IP at all. I hope you will at least give these points the benefit of the doubt and would conclude, like I do now, that at the very least it's still simply too early to tell exactly what NCsoft's intentions are with all this.
To begin with let's review CoH's overall relevance to NCsoft. Even during the height of CoH's popularity during the 2004-2012 timeframe CoH only represented roughly 5-10% of NCsoft's total yearly revenue. As a South Korean company whose main business focus was based on its "local" Korean style games CoH was always (to them) a foreign outlier that never represented the core of their business. This fact was highlighted when they attempted to create a local Korean version of the game (named [url=https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/City_of_Heroes#City_of_Hero]City of Hero[/url]) that so badly failed to generate any public interest that it never even got out of the initial beta testing stage. One can only assume this left a proverbial "bad taste" in their mouths for the IP in general.
Then let's recall how CoH's shutdown was handled. NCsoft unilaterally announced in August 2012 that they would shut CoH down without even Paragon Studios being aware they were planning to make that move. At the time CoH was still a profitable game and by all estimates probably had at least 2 to 4 more years of reasonable profitability left to it. Clearly NCsoft's motivation to drop CoH was not based solely on money - as I just said it was still MAKING money for NCsoft. So one has to ask just how much NCsoft would care about defending an IP that they themselves specifically CHOSE to shut down 6.5 years ago. For whatever reason they literally decided that LOSING money on the property was actually a better business alternative for them. Let this point truly sink in...
Finally one can review how NCsoft has made use of the IP since the 2012 shutdown. The only tangible use of the IP since 2012 has been when NCsoft decided to re-use the Statesman character for their very ill-fated [url=https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Master_X_Master]Master X Master[/url] MOBA game. This game failed so hard that it barely lasted six months before it was put out of its misery. Based on that unfortunate experience one can again only assume that from NCsoft's point of view the "potential future value" of the CoH IP had become very minimal.
So we're left with trying to guess what NCsoft is going to want to do with a 15+ year old IP that they themselves willingly chose to shut down. It's easy to speculate that the overall market value of the CoH IP was likely never higher than it was in 2012 and it can only have depreciated sharply in the years since. When you add up all the indicators that NCsoft effectively wanted to kill the IP themselves and apparently never even bothered to sincerely entertain the idea of selling it to someone else you end up with a fairly bleak picture: NCsoft likely [i]doesn't care enough[/i] about the IP to mount a protracted, costly legal defense. They might have already "run the numbers" and decided that the overall cost to defend this relatively worthless IP would not be of any benefit to them. In effect they might just stand back silently and let the SCORE thing happen, especially if SCORE can effectively convince everyone that they are not planning to try to make a PROFIT from running CoH.
Again time will tell which way NCsoft reacts. I simply believe there's a lot of convincing evidence pointing to the theory that they may just stand aside and basically "forget" that they technically own the IP. They gave up making money on the IP themselves years ago; as long as no one else makes any money off of it what do they really care what happens to it? Ironically enough it might actually be NCsoft themselves that doesn't want to touch CoH with that 10 foot pole...
CoH player from April 25, 2004 to November 30, 2012
[IMG=400x225]https://i.imgur.com/NHUthWM.jpeg[/IMG]
*digging across cluttered desk*
[img]https://i.kym-cdn.com/entries/icons/original/000/001/625/135891.jpg[/img]
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[color=red]PR, Forum Moderator[/color]
[url=http://cityoftitans.com/forum/desvipers-creative-impulsivity]My Non-Canon Backstories[/url]
Avatar by MikeNovember
My legacy lives!
You guys are going to look pretty silly when I make this pic my sig pic. ;)
CoH player from April 25, 2004 to November 30, 2012
[IMG=400x225]https://i.imgur.com/NHUthWM.jpeg[/IMG]
WHARRGARBLOTHIC
Water / Mental Manipulation Blaster... GO!
:P
"Just, well, update your kickstarter email addresses, okay? Make sure they're current?" - warcabbit
Would make it way easier to find. My face hurts form smashing the keyboard into google images.
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[color=red]PR, Forum Moderator[/color]
[url=http://cityoftitans.com/forum/desvipers-creative-impulsivity]My Non-Canon Backstories[/url]
Avatar by MikeNovember
Warbargarbal.
I don't disagree with your comments. I'm a known pessimist. I fear the unknown and suspect the worse in many things. I very much would like to see the rogue servers develop and grow into something new and wonderful. I hope that they can untangle some of the spaghetti. But I also know that NCsoft is a corporate entity which are the most wrathful and vindictive people on the planet (corporations are people too) I also know that in the entertainment industry IP is like gold and companies will horde them like gluttonous dragons. IP rarely changes hands for free and is rarely surrendered. I can not think of an moderately popular IP that has ever been surrendered to the public.
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Saga of Ryzom (which I played back when it was still something you paid for) went to open source. So did Meridian 59, which is best-known as the first MMORPG. (It predated Ultima Online by a year.)
It is rare but not unheard of.
Sure my post was a long one. But then again there's a HUGE amount of evidence to support my position on the matter.
I continue to stand by the premise that every day that goes by that NCsoft doesn't act to stop the rogue CoH servers makes their case to do so that much weaker. I will never assume that NCsoft will completely give up their "right" to try to stop it from happening, but their current inaction speaks volumes.
Remember that just because we fans care about CoH doesn't mean that the current corporate suits at NCsoft do.
CoH player from April 25, 2004 to November 30, 2012
[IMG=400x225]https://i.imgur.com/NHUthWM.jpeg[/IMG]
After playing CoH for a while now, I have a simple request.
Can we please get a clock (local and server time) as part of the UI?
It's so annoying to log in for a mission or three and suddenly find you've been playing for hours. And who wants to tab out all the time to check the time?
[url=https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W_HUdf89hI8]Send out your signal, call in your hero
I kidnapped his lady, now his power's are zero.
[/url]
Lol people have been asking for a "clock" in the CoH GUI since 2004... Funny how some things never change. ;)
P.S. For what it's worth no one looking at or in charge of this forum would be able to help you with that regardless.
CoH player from April 25, 2004 to November 30, 2012
[IMG=400x225]https://i.imgur.com/NHUthWM.jpeg[/IMG]
I meant for CoT. =P
[url=https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W_HUdf89hI8]Send out your signal, call in your hero
I kidnapped his lady, now his power's are zero.
[/url]
Well as I just implied if CoT is going to be a true "spiritual successor" to CoH I would think "no" would be the answer to your request. Who knows, maybe MWM will decide differently. ;)
CoH player from April 25, 2004 to November 30, 2012
[IMG=400x225]https://i.imgur.com/NHUthWM.jpeg[/IMG]
Also an option for timestamps.
I'm part of the input for the design of the UI, ill definitely bring it up.
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[color=#FF0000]Graphic Designer[/color]
Thanks.
[url=https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W_HUdf89hI8]Send out your signal, call in your hero
I kidnapped his lady, now his power's are zero.
[/url]
Are most of you in the same boat in regards to needing/wanting a time displayed? It would be good feedback.
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[color=#FF0000]Graphic Designer[/color]
"Dont you have phones?"
-Blizzard
Compulsively clicking the refresh button until the next update.
I have a pocket watch that is also a calculator, a library, and a connection to the Interwebs. Oh, and it's a phone, too. But it's not convenient to leave it where I can see it to check the time, so I'll second the request for an in-game real-world clock that can be displayed with the UI.
Foradain, Mage of Phoenix Rising.
[url=https://cityoftitans.com/forum/foradains-character-conclave]Foradain's Character Conclave[/url]
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Avatar courtesy of [s]Satellite9[/s] [url=https://www.instagram.com/irezoomie/]Irezoomie[/url]
It's honestly one of the best "healthy gameplay" type features you can have. My favorite mod from Fallout 4 was swapping in-game time in the loading screen with realtime.
Bonus points if it's military time ;) Watching it go from 2300 to 0000 is a bit of a shock an encourages sleep.
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[color=red]PR, Forum Moderator[/color]
[url=http://cityoftitans.com/forum/desvipers-creative-impulsivity]My Non-Canon Backstories[/url]
Avatar by MikeNovember
+1829!
Any clock I have that can be made to display in a 24 hour mode has been set to do so.
Foradain, Mage of Phoenix Rising.
[url=https://cityoftitans.com/forum/foradains-character-conclave]Foradain's Character Conclave[/url]
.
Avatar courtesy of [s]Satellite9[/s] [url=https://www.instagram.com/irezoomie/]Irezoomie[/url]
A clock and connection quality indicator has already been planned. I'm also hoping to add calendar functionality to the time as well as warnings after you've played a certain amount of time if you want it. Hell, I made up a clock and ping widget more than a year ago! Seemed to have lost my original files sadly but I've easily found a way to reproduce them (they were out of date anyways).
Speaking of time - today's my birthday! (I'm 52 ). It's amusing when I tell people that. Apparently I look like I'm still in my mid-30s. :D
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[color=#FF0000]Senior Developer/Project Manager/Co-Founder... and then some.[/color]
Thanks for clarifying. And Happy Birthday! Woooo ^_^
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[color=#FF0000]Graphic Designer[/color]
Happy Birthday!
Yeah I get a 30s-early 40s vibe way more than a 50s vibe :p
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[color=red]PR, Forum Moderator[/color]
[url=http://cityoftitans.com/forum/desvipers-creative-impulsivity]My Non-Canon Backstories[/url]
Avatar by MikeNovember
Happy B-day!
I actually wouldn't mind if these things (i.e. a clock, connection quality indicator, etc.) were OPTIONS we could choose. Personally I would likely choose [b]not[/b] to have these things appear on my screen but I obviously have no problem with them being optional things for those that do want them.
Remember it would likely be far more annoying for these things to be displayed by default when a player [b]doesn't[/b] want to see them than wanting to see such things when they're not an option. ;)
Happy Birthday... I'm only a few years behind you. Gods we're old... lol
CoH player from April 25, 2004 to November 30, 2012
[IMG=400x225]https://i.imgur.com/NHUthWM.jpeg[/IMG]
See now I definitely had Lothic pegged as late 40s-early 50s :p
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[color=red]PR, Forum Moderator[/color]
[url=http://cityoftitans.com/forum/desvipers-creative-impulsivity]My Non-Canon Backstories[/url]
Avatar by MikeNovember
Not sure if I need to be offended or not. ;)
I've already mentioned my general age on this forum several other times regardless. How old a person's "pop references" are usually gives it away for most people.
CoH player from April 25, 2004 to November 30, 2012
[IMG=400x225]https://i.imgur.com/NHUthWM.jpeg[/IMG]
For what its worth, I pegged you in your 30's Lothic :P
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[color=#FF0000]Graphic Designer[/color]
Congrats on completion of a full deck's worth of trips around the Sun! You're still a couple behind me, though. ^_^
Foradain, Mage of Phoenix Rising.
[url=https://cityoftitans.com/forum/foradains-character-conclave]Foradain's Character Conclave[/url]
.
Avatar courtesy of [s]Satellite9[/s] [url=https://www.instagram.com/irezoomie/]Irezoomie[/url]
Well I started on these forums in college so I guess I'm way younger than most of you.
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[color=red]PR, Forum Moderator[/color]
[url=http://cityoftitans.com/forum/desvipers-creative-impulsivity]My Non-Canon Backstories[/url]
Avatar by MikeNovember
Clocks, timers, calendars, that's all definitely a plus in promoting healthy gameplay.
[color=red]PR Team, Forum Moderator, Live Response Team[/color]
Same, well I started playing the year after I graduated high school and a year after it had launched.
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[color=#FF0000]Graphic Designer[/color]
I remember at one point bringing up the idea of being able to set an in-game timed message (i.e. "At time X/after Y interval, pop up a box with *text* in it" function, with a few pre-generated *text* choices).
[color=#ff0000]Composition Team[/color]
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