How deep is CoT going to be outside the basic MMO stuff (PvP; PvE; Questing; probably crafting). The basic stuff is neat but only entertains for so long. I read that housing is potentially in, which is awesome. Can you have more than one? One for the secret lair & one casual Jane/Joe city apartment? And what about fluff activities; can I go a whole gaming day along with my alter ego to do mundane stuff like selling ice cream from an ice cream truck (until someone screams help and Vanilla Flavor Man is needed) or repairing electronics in his hardware store (could all be mini-games which rewards currency to simulate a chars job)? Can my char switch on a TV in his apartment which shows clips the devs have uploaded (maybe a record of the latest raid; shown like a news report)? Will the game offer personal life NPCs to complement the character (think of the Kents and some key people at the Daily Planet for Superman)?
Sat, 06/09/2018 - 23:21
#1
Behind the mask; non-combat content
Welcome to the forums!
And not to poo-poo on one of your very first posts [i]but[/i] just for clarification; you want to log into a superhero/villain game and be able to play as a normal person? I personally find it difficult to imagine that the amount of manpower/hours/resources put towards such an effort wouldn't have a limited number of returns that it would be viable to develop, especially as there are currently games/environments that allow you to do that already [i]and[/i] to a much higher degree of fidelity and realism (The Sims, Second Life, etc).
The closest CoH/V got to such a thing, as far as I can remember, was the Day Job perks a player got from logging out in certain places.
And it's not to say that it can't be implemented or that it's a bad idea. I'm certain that it could be developed and that its a decent concept, but for a company with (currently) limited resources, they should (at least in the beginning) put their efforts towards something that would/will appeal to the majority of players.
I'm not signing up for the Sims. I want a comic book style adventure.
Just how fun is it to RP a barbecue?
[img]https://s15.postimg.cc/z9bk1znkb/Black_Falcon_Sig_in_Progess.jpg[/img]
Welcome to the forums!
I see your point and agree that such things have worked and been really fun in games that did them (GTA online has tons of fun little side mini games that are "normal people" activities instead of stealing things and blowing stuff up). Cobalt isn't wrong though....even in GTA online most people are spending their time with the core experience of the game, not playing virtual darts or tennis or whatnot. A fair amount of people do car races but that is pretty close to core content. An analogue to a superhero game would be something like.....competing on a leaderboard for completing super hero obstacle courses and beating up bad guys? To be fair to control and defense characters you'd have to have "damage taken" factored in among other things to the final score, not just how fast you went.......Anyway, getting off track.
Those things are cool and fun and definitely great for showing off how much a dev team can polish up little stuff and make a world breathe.
You need the core stuff first though. Nobody cares how nice the seats are in a car that has no wheels or engine.
Even once the game is ready for launch you are going to see many more people pushing for content and upgrades to the core experience vs minigames.
That being said I am honestly really hoping MWM does put some "side" content in, even if it is closely tied to the core experience by using the core game mechanics.
Base defense missions and obstacle course / arena / danger room type would be fun and thematic.
Having non-combat oriented quests would be alright. The devs have before stated that they want to add detective style missions which would probably be lighter on the combat side. If they had some Oracle/Calculator type missions too that'd be great.
But if you want to play house, there's always RP.
Also I wouldn't be adversed to having missions that could intersect with a character's normal life. Like you start a mission as Clark Kent, end it with Superman. Or have the super hero stuff in between. Essentially it'd be cutscene with dialogue options for your day job, followed by super hero action, followed by closing with the same as what it started with. Could work pretty well, like in the paths you'd build up relationships with NPCs and based on your choices they might be able to discover your identity then either keep it a secret or out you.
"Let the past die. Kill it if you have to."
Non-powered side missions and mini-games would be fun to see implemented. I can see a sandwich-stacker mini game where you have to make sandwiches to customers' orders. Maybe a disaster emergency first aid and triage mini-game where we have to stabilize and/or medivac the victims. There could be all manner of nifty games like this.
But then I got to thinking about how characters with an infinite array of power concepts would participate in these games. I see the only way to balance the challenge of the games would be to design them around a baseline powers capability, which would have to assume no powers at all. And that might not be well received by the playerbase.
Some ways to make it work might be: [list]
[*]The mini game is a charity competition in which the characters are not allowed to use their powers as part of the rules, and there is press and a cheering audience to watch. All participants get increased reputation with a certain faction and the winning player might get some extra rep, influence, and maybe some token reward.
[*]The characters participate as their secret identity and as such can not evince their powers/abilities. (this assumes that characters have a secret identity and a spare costume slot, but this might be a good opportunity for the game to award an additional costume slot to the characters who participate)
[*]The characters are in an alternate dimension or under the influence of someone with god-like powers who is able to keep characters from using their own powers. (this sounds more like a full scale mission than a mini-game, but it could be a seasonal thing like making toys at the North Pole by a slave-owning Santa who kidnaps random people to be his "elves" every winter)
[*]Characters are given temporary powers via a gizmo or some such and it is these temporary powers that are used for the mini-game.
[/list]
[hr]I like to take your ideas and supersize them. This isn't criticism, it is flattery. I come with nothing but good will and a spirit of team-building. If you take what I write any other way, that is probably just because I wasn't very clear.
If you search the forums, you will find that this has been brought up a couple of times.
We entertained the idea of a Secret ID system, but ultimately had to shelve the idea. The issue is hat in order to fully implement one properly would require us to essentially make an entire game itself.
It is a large undertaking for something that only a segment of the population would use as not all concepts require secret IDs. The work involved would require a dedicated team to maintain as it requires another set of analytics and metrics.
There was an mmo being developed that had a secret if system complete with multiple jobs which were mini games into themselves. Then when alerts happened you could switch to your hero and deal with the alert.
There were possible repercussions of “leaving work” and such. But for many, the mini game became just that - work, something that was required to do while waiting for the fun action to happen. Ultimately, the game was canned. Parts were used to create a new game relying on the lore of the old.
Knowing someone who played with the older game and hearing his experiences and those of the team he worked with from his point of view, the lesson learned was that as interesting as it may sound on the surface, the drastic differences in the content were basically two games being made at the same time and being constantly reworked to try and blend them into one, cohesive game and it never quite worked. There were parts that were fun, systems that were downright innovative. And a lot that when released to larger pools of players that just didn’t work well.
Funnily enough, as I said earlier, we had come to the conclusion that to do the secret ID system right they it would require a game innof itself. This was made prior to the knowledge of what happened with this other game.
Now we do have ideas for a secret id game that can work with CoT. We are a long way off from making it a reality.
Meanwhile, personal bases can be apartment sized, and can be made to look like a typical living space.
People can use a costume slot to costume their character in civilian style clothing and role play with other players. Use their personal base with a permission setting to grant group members access. There will be plenty of options for places to role play with minimal effort on the development side compatibility speaking.
[hr]I don't use a nerf bat, I have a magic crowbar!
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I’d love to see a mobile app you link to your CoT account and you can do mundane secret ID stuff that gives some kind of benefit to your character in CoT. It could be little puzzles and minigames. But don’t make it something players feel they have to do.
Yeah, we don't want this game to be The Sims: Superhero Pack.
On the other hand, someone else said it already, but it's definitely worth it to have a good look at GTA Online.
It definitely feels like you're in a living, breathing world in that game.
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Neverwinter has a system vaguely like this in place for Crafting. Crafting is done by essentially NPCs (they're not actual characters in the game, but resources that you have in your crafting inventory that are styled as people; Blacksmiths, Tailors, etc), and you assign tasks to them which they will carry out for you over a proscribed length of time.
You can assign them tasks from within the game, OR(and) there's a website which is linked to the game and lets you manage your crafting without needing to log in. You can send your crafters to gather materials, craft items, and do associated tasks at any time you have internet access.
Something like this linked to secret ID/day job could be interesting.
Thanks for the warm welcome & the answers :)
Its wait and see I guess. A tad sad to hear a secret ID system is that challenging to implement & and a bit weird its so easily dismissed from superhero fans though. I would never have sunk the big amount of cash into my comic collection if it where not for the interesting interactions between the heroes and their personal live in addition to the super stuff they can do. Its what gives them meaning when ripping evil a new one beyond "because they can".
Well, I'm still looking forward to CoT & its not like MMOs are static or ever really finished. :)
I was not talking about "RP" ing barbecues :D
More talking about swoping down behind the actual ingame BBQ Grill steakhouse, quickly changing the Major Awesome gear into civil clothes and doing some fun & optional minigames inside said grill which grant some cash and while we are at it maybe some buff food.
I don't think its such a horrible idea to have some mini games that imitate real life jobs. I think secret identities will always be a part of the super hero world whether in game or on the page.
At the same time, I would hate to see a mini game such as prepare these pizza orders before the timer runs out -
I think it would need to be a little more challenging than that. But it does sound like a big hassle to figure that out at this point and im already anxious to play this game as it is lol.
Oh and welcome!
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[color=#FF0000]Graphic Designer[/color]
It would be neat, but sit back and take some time to run through as many super powered concepts (hero, neutral/gray, villain) as you can. Then figure out if they would use a secret identity (or care if the public knew they were super powered) and want to perform mundane tasks (odd jobs, careers, gossiping, gathering street level intel). That will probably generate a big matrix of things that would need to be coded (basically what Tannim alluded to).
I am going to guess that some of the more intricate paths ([url=https://cityoftitans.com/forum/please-tell-me-about-path-system]Path System[/url]) will incorporate some non-combat activities. There will also be an opportunity to experience user created door missions (mission builder). Plus all of the crowd sourced events lean heavily on being involved in the community (League conflicts, costume contests, drive by assistance). So under the planned system, having something to do other than your character quests or raids will depend on how much you involve yourself and choose to RP.
"Just, well, update your kickstarter email addresses, okay? Make sure they're current?" - warcabbit
Depending on who you do it with and if you don't do it all the time. It can be pretty damn fun! Do it all the time. Less so. It's not like playing the actual game. :p
That said, ever try to just throw in some RP banter while running missions. People can get upset with that! O.O And that's just mindless text being typed quickly! But noooo, it slows down the mission! :p
Pizza delivering minigame ala Spiderman 2 the game.
"Let the past die. Kill it if you have to."
One idea from ThatWeirdo that didn't get addressed was "televising" big multiplayer events like a newscast. I think it's a facinating (though non-essential) idea.
Once upon a time, Funcom's Anarchy Online had video screens in-game in public places. The screens showed real world tv commercials, which at that time was one of the costs of free-to-play; subscribers could turn off the commercials. I think it could be fun if the results of some big event (maybe a world boss fight during a seasonal event, for example) could occasionally get that sort of treatment. That feel of "hey I made the evening news" fits in with the experience of being a superhero, I think.
It wouldn't be a minigame, and would really only require having a couple of devs or player volunteers on hand at the event to produce a cinematic, add a brief voiceover narrative, convert to whatever in-game vid format you're using, then loop the thing until the next such event. The screens could be just about anywhere, like public transit stations, over the main entrance of the offices of a major metropolitan newspaper, libraries, etc.
Just an idea, probably for year two or later.
I like that idea super, and it could be easier to implement than you think if you limit it more to billboards or have the "announcer" voice be more like sim gibberish. You could take mugshots of players straight from their character data and put them up on wanted posters, shots for the evening news, advertisements, etc.
One example of this is XCOM2 which dynamically generates wanted posters of your characters that you can see around city levels. It is much easier to throw up a mugshot with some text scrolling under it for a few seconds than it is to handmake a movie, and this could be done in such a way that any time an event of significance happens around the city gets placed into the pool to show up for X amount of time.
You could even take that a step further to personalize the show and have screens in areas where players are have a much higher chance of showing events that involved the players in that zone. This could include screens in player homes too which could really help sell that feeling of being part of the world when you come back to your base and hear about what you've done. Throw in some additional shots that only play based the relevant event such as path story events, completing the tutorial, beating a giant monster, getting an achievement, or anything else, and the little news stories could start to feel very real.
This sort of system would be vastly easier to implement and could be added to as additional content was created. You could even have your personal computer in your base keep a history of such stories to replay and share with visitors.
Didn't they remove the website for that due to extensive boting?
I don’t know why the site was removed but yes it was shut down a while back. I always thought the way it was set up was awkward anyway. Making there be out-of-game content on a web site is redundant; if I’m at my computer I’d rather just play the game. A mobile app is a different story and it’s something you can do on the fly anywhere.
Many times it is easier to make a website that is mobile friendly compared to making apps that have both phone and tablet mode for both Android and iOS. Also looked up the [url=https://www.arcgames.com/tr/games/neverwinter/news/detail/10161142-gateway-closing-down]official announcement of the shutdown[/url], it was primarily for botting. Considering how crafting was organized and "time consuming" (in that it took a long time to get anywhere with it) I certainly don't blame people for botting that part, and kinda which I knew about it before they shut that site down.
That site did end up having some unique content before it ended in the form of a companions only D&D adventure type mini games, [url=https://www.arcgames.com/en/games/neverwinter/news/detail/3029613-sword-coast-adventures-power-dice-guide]Sword Coast Adventures[/url].
AFAIK they planned something like that for STO too. Already had a page akin to the WoW armory. Could look up your fleets, chars, crews, ships & layouts but that never left a clunky beta stage. Did not had the botting excuse so they said its because not many used it. But thats post COH/V Cryptic; have a neat idea, start it half baked, don't have the attention span & endurance to see it through and than scrap it because nobody wants to use the unfinished buggy mess & blame the players.
Tannim, that sounds a LOT like how Titan became Overwatch, is that what you're speaking of?
Because, if so, I'd love to hear more of how Titan played.
I can’t say specifically it was that game (coughs).
[hr]I don't use a nerf bat, I have a magic crowbar!
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[color=#ff0000]Tech Team. [/color]
I can see this idea as a 'non-heroic' mini-game to play when you don't feel like putting on your super-suit, but I expect it would get boring after a short while.
I prefer to put on a big smile with lens-flare and punch mooks in the face.
Be Well!
Fireheart