Radiac wrote:

Cyclops mentioned Swinging as a travel power above. I still hate that as a "go anywhere" travel power, as it would patently not work over flat terrain, water, or anywhere else that doesn't provide you with obvious places to attach a web or grapnel, etc. If the idea is to anchor the rope or whatever in mid air, that just sucks, to me.

Yeah TBH the idea of a Swinging travel power that DOESN'T need buildings or other structures to anchor the line to is a stretch for my suspension of disbelief. Now (like Brainbot said) in some cases you could rationalize it away as a "magic rope" that could lock itself in mid-air using "magic" or some such. But the idea that EVERYBODY who swings is going to be using a super-special magic rope that can do that is a little dubious to say the least.

Radiac wrote:

It would look extraordinarily goofy and wrong, like wings that let you fly but don't flap.

Wings don't have to flap to allow flight. Just ask Buzz Lightyear (with locked fixed wing rocket powered flight) or anybody who glides with wings. Now maybe if a person's wings are like "angel" or "devil" wings and they can fly without flapping then maybe I could see your problem with that.

I did state it was just my opinion. I think the CoT devs are actually planning on doing Swinging (was it mentioned on the Kickstarter? I forget now...). I just personally wouldn't, that's all. Spider-man and Batman aren't using some form of magic when they swing on their various swinglines, they're supposedly using some kind of rope or polymer extrusion to anchor to a building and then swing like a pendulum from there. It works in comics and cartoons mostly because you have the freedom to put the necessary building off camera somewhere and just brush the realism aside. In an MMO you don't have that level of control. Even if the swinger is using 1st person PoV, those of us in the area will see the swingling attaching to thin air and have to try not to laugh at the ridiculousness of it all. In the comics they're attaching those lines to real, solid buildings, at least in theory. And they always START on the roof of some building or another first. I like wallcrawling. I don't have a problem with that. But allowing the use of swinging in places when swinging CLEARLY won't help you just harshes my suspension of disbelief way too much.

Seeing it just makes me go "Ugh... there's ALWAYS a canal?!?!" a la that episode of the Simpsons with Nightboat, the crime solving boat.

[youtube]uoV1-fsFCmw[/youtube]

Radiac wrote:

Seeing it just makes me go "Ugh... there's ALWAYS a canal?!?!" a la that episode of the Simpsons with Nightboat, the crime solving boat.

Or a fjord!

Phararri wrote:

DCUO is the worst superhero game of all time. I would rather play Marvel puzzle quest, but man they had some nice hand to hand weapons.
What would have been awesome if the player could fire fire powers from the lion's mouth

Makes me think of Voltron. #GoLion

Playability, in the general sense, does not demand a Swinging power to exist at all in the game in the first place, in my opinion. Case in point, CoX was very playable, and it had no such power.

If you're going to do Swinging and you have to make it a "works everywhere" power, then you have to have this level of totally ridiculous lack of realism, that I grant, but to me that's a reason not to bother doing it at all.

But again, I speak only for myself and what I would do if I were making those decisions, which I am not.

Regarding swinging as a travel power. I would really like it if actual physics were used.

It would not be a travel power for the faint of heart, and I would expect a lot of people would face plant into the sides of buildings or flinging themselves off into open sky until they really got the trick of it. But that would be its own reward.

Interestingly, there is a game that already uses swinging. I found out about it from my Skyforge guild [i]Vashta Nerada[/i]. Probably the best MMO guild I've ever been involved with.

Here it is: The [url=http://fenglee.com/game/aog/][i]Attack on Titan[/i] tribute game[/url].

notears wrote:

Well we could also broaden the term of "anchor point" to include things other than buildings and gargoyles like say, that cliff over there, or that tree branch. At the least we should make all travel powers viable in a city. The games not called FOREST of titans after all ;p Travel powers should atleast be mostly useful if not always useful.

Sure if the Devs of CoT are clever enough they might make enough "anchor points" out of all sorts of things to expand the amount of space where swinging would be seen as "viable".

Alternatively they might make swinging strictly require anchor points but as a compromise make it super fast or super stealthy as a side benefit. This means that it might not be usable 100% of the time but at least in the places where it was allowed it might be made extra fast or given some other benefit that offsets its restricted use. This would be like if they ever created a "Super Swim" power that let you swim superfast but you could only use it in water.

notears wrote:

In video games starring Spider-Man, especially open world ones, you could just hold a button and swing in place, and we still have to consider something very important that's basic for game theory... playability before realism.

Not necessarily....
[youtube]ZioHC2luLU8[/youtube]

Over on the [url=https://cityoftitans.com/forum/discuss-what-we-can-do-powers]Discuss: What We Can Do -Powers[/url] thread I found [url=https://cityoftitans.com/comment/118950#comment-118950]this[/url]:

BiotopeZ wrote:

Another animation that comes to mind is on-foot wing use in melee. This could be an animation overlay for some ground-based movements. This is using wings to lunge, jump back fast, turn quick, etc, while on foot. I'm not planning on making any winged characters, but I always thought winged characters looked like they were wearing cosplay wings when fighting on foot... they just look plastic, when they could still be useful to some extent. The same goes with tail, really. Ever watch a big cat on the hunt, it will swing its tail out in the opposite direction that it turns as a counter-weight to turn faster. Think like that, but with wings.

And [url=https://cityoftitans.com/comment/119079#comment-119079]this[/url]:

Tannim222 wrote:

Certain props will have specific anims such as two-handed weapom attacks, having a weapon and shield, etc. But these are alll independant from the powers themselves.
Now, whether thatt will end up being done with other costume parts, suck as wings - depends on vertain factors including how the rigs of the wings are set up. Also if there are compounded issues with wings moving as described and other props in hand. As it is, those issues don't exist with wings and props or caps and props.
It is definitely more of an exploratory issue for much later down the line.

I'd like suggest, not just incorporating wings and tails into melee animations, but treating them as potential melee weapons. Especially tails. If I have a thagomizer on my tail, I want to be able to treat the bad guys like the [url=https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Thagomizer.png]late Thag Simmons.[/url]

Looking at the last line of Tannim222's quoted above, that likely applies to this as well, if not more so. But I think it should be on the list of stuff to explore down the line.

notears wrote:

Brainbot wrote:
You know, if a player thinks a power like swinging does not work in certain settings they could always choose not to use it in those settings. There is also the idea supplementing swinging by adding a logical functionality in the form of wing suits, deployable glider or some other gadgetry.
that's actually a good point... maybe swinging isn't just about swinging... maybe it could also be about gliding... again kind of like the batman Arkham games...

Obviously some characters who use the Swinging travel power are going to be like Spider-Man (with other built-in powers). But a huge majority of them are probably going to be more like Batman who uses gadgets to swing around. If you can use one gadget (for Swinging) there's no serious reason why you probably wouldn't use other gadgets for gliding/climbing and such. We already know that Batman uses other gadgets to simulate travel powers like the Batmobile to simulate Super Speed and the Batplane to simulate Flight. ;)

Brainbot wrote:

Line zipping does not have to be vertical. It could just as easily be used horizontal/at an angle to solve the 'no buildings to swing on' problem that some take issue with.

Even where such buildings might be miles away? I'm not anti-Swing here - I'm just trying to be a realist where it comes to "reasonable practically". There's no universal law that says every travel power must be universally viable in all situations. *shrugs*

Brainbot wrote:

Lothic wrote:

Even where such buildings might be miles away? I'm not anti-Swing here - I'm just trying to be a realist where it comes to "reasonable practically". There's no universal law that says every travel power must be universally viable in all situations. *shrugs*

Yes even if you were in an infinite flat terrain you can still shoot the line at the ground a ways in front of your character and either jump as zipping or just slide along the ground. I'm not pro swing here, just showing that the 'problems' people are coming up with are very narrow. There isn't a universal reason they can't make all the travel powers viable in all situations either.

I'll grant you that if you found yourself on "infinitely flat terrain you could shoot a line at the ground a ways in front of your character". But your assumptions that you could then jump up and zip forward without instantly faceplanting in the dirt or that this magical terrain is slippery enough that you could just slide forward is only maybe 0.000001% less stupid than having to accept that swing lines should just be able to be fired into the air randomly and anchor themselves to nothing. The 'problems' people are coming up with are NOT very narrow with respect to swing lines. If the only way you can make swing lines work universally is to dream up a "magically infinite flat terrain" for them to operate on then almost by definition they are NOT universal.

Look I get that people want a Swinging travel power in CoT and there's absolutely NOTHING wrong with that as long as you keep something like that within the realms of sanity, even sanity as it pertains to a superhero based game. As I said before you might be able to explain one character using a magical swing line that can defy gravity but are we going to be forced to accept that ALL swing lines in the world can universally defy the laws of physics? If that's going to be the case then that's going to be awfully silly to say the least.

I just don't get this need to have all travel powers be universally practical and/or usable. If there was a burrowing travel power I wouldn't expect to be able to "burrow" through thin air with it. If there was a motorcycle based travel power I wouldn't expect to be able to zip across the surface of an ocean with it. Yes I get that the "it's a superhero game" can excuse a whole bunch of physics-defying silliness. But at the end of the day there have to be SOME limits to these things or else we'll just have a chaotic mess on our hands.

Lothic wrote:

Brainbot wrote:
Lothic wrote:
Even where such buildings might be miles away? I'm not anti-Swing here - I'm just trying to be a realist where it comes to "reasonable practically". There's no universal law that says every travel power must be universally viable in all situations. *shrugs*
Yes even if you were in an infinite flat terrain you can still shoot the line at the ground a ways in front of your character and either jump as zipping or just slide along the ground. I'm not pro swing here, just showing that the 'problems' people are coming up with are very narrow. There isn't a universal reason they can't make all the travel powers viable in all situations either.
I'll grant you that if you found yourself on "infinitely flat terrain you could shoot a line at the ground a ways in front of your character". But your assumptions that you could then jump up and zip forward without instantly faceplanting in the dirt or that this magical terrain is slippery enough that you could just slide forward is only maybe 0.000001% less stupid than having to accept that swing lines should just be able to be fired into the air randomly and anchor themselves to nothing. The 'problems' people are coming up with are NOT very narrow with respect to swing lines. If the only way you can make swing lines work universally is to dream up a "magically infinite flat terrain" for them to operate on then almost by definition they are NOT universal.
Look I get that people want a Swinging travel power in CoT and there's absolutely NOTHING wrong with that as long as you keep something like that within the realms of sanity, even sanity as it pertains to a superhero based game. As I said before you might be able to explain one character using a magical swing line that can defy gravity but are we going to be forced to accept that ALL swing lines in the world can universally defy the laws of physics? If that's going to be the case then that's going to be awfully silly to say the least.
I just don't get this need to have all travel powers be universally practical and/or usable. If there was a burrowing travel power I wouldn't expect to be able to "burrow" through thin air with it. If there was a motorcycle based travel power I wouldn't expect to be able to zip across the surface of an ocean with it. Yes I get that the "it's a superhero game" can excuse a whole bunch of physics-defying silliness. But at the end of the day there have to be SOME limits to these things or else we'll just have a chaotic mess on our hands.

I get what you're saying Lothic.

However, I think the point is this.

If you do it the way you say, which is totally how it would work, in say a comic book and a non MMO game. It'd be one thing.

However, in the MMO world. We'd start seeing people just taking the super powers that worked best.

Didn't make sense to super jump off of water in CoH, people still took it.

If you put restrictions like you want on the travel powers, then people will start pulling away from their use. Can't swing line in the desert, so everyone is complaining about how that player is being slow getting to missions, or the player is just annoyed at being slow getting to the missions. Not to mention PvP zones without high structures to use for them.

In the comics, Spidey has to find other ways to use his swing lines, or just walk (when the artist/writer don't fub it anyways). In MMO, I think we'd start seeing people just skipping the powers.

Unless, CoT just ignores the idea of deserts, jungles, artic wastelands, the moon and stick strictly to a city setting.

Lothic wrote:

Brand X wrote:
If you put restrictions like you want on the travel powers, then people will start pulling away from their use. Can't swing line in the desert, so everyone is complaining about how that player is being slow getting to missions, or the player is just annoyed at being slow getting to the missions. Not to mention PvP zones without high structures to use for them.
If the Devs decide to make every single travel power they provide be UNIVERSALLY usable just because they don't want some players to shy away from using some of them over others then I suppose we'll all have to live with that silliness. If that applies to some kind of Swinging travel power I'll likely declare that to be "stupid" and I'll never use it on one of my characters. Now if that kind of thing would not bother YOU then more power to you and I wish you all the joy in the world using such a travel power.
But just imagine if my vocal position on this particular topic forces the CoT Devs to at least think about it and maybe gets them to combine their universal swing line with some other tech (like the wing suit) that will at least PARTIALLY explain why a swing line could be used anywhere then I consider what I'm doing here as a useful service for my fellow player. Constructive criticism is a good thing.

As someone who uses a swing line in CO, it still totally bothers me. :p But I realize sometimes you just have to make do. DCUO's swing line feels a bit better, as it looks to need anchor points to use, but then it doesn't feel like you're swinging around like Spider-Man.

Brainbot wrote:

I remember reading a book or watching some show, I think it was Criminal Minds but don't know because the plot was pretty silly. In that book or show a guy sets off a bunch of bombs to get people to increase national security. When he got caught he was so sure he was acting heroically.
For some reason that bad guys dumb rationale just came to mind.

It's been the basis for a few shows.

So I was thinking earlier that it would be cool to have a geometry blast. Your character shoots out a riot of 2d or 3d simple geometric forms. Could be interesting for making a cool particle man or triangle man concept. (que music)

The devs have stated that you can take multiple travel powers if you like. So in the city you could use your swinging power and then take SS or SJ for when you couldn't use swing. It's very clear in that first spiderman clip that he's got swing and SJ at least.

We need special animation so Scorpion can have robot scorpions...

Interdictor wrote:

Brand X wrote:
notears wrote:
never seen it.... is there a shotgun axe on there? Is agents of S.H.I.E.L.D good? Because I want to watch it just for the shotgun axe!!!
Every season of AoS is better than the last. Season 1 needed work. Has some good episodes, about the last half it starts to improve.
And yes, in season 2 or 3 (forget which) the creation of the Shotgun Axe is made and still used!
Yeah - season 1 was really hampered by the fact it aired around the same time that Captain America: Winter Soldier released (and if you have seen that movie you get an idea of how that might have affected the TV show). The first half of the 1st season is basically in a holding pattern. The second half is when it starts to get interesting, and like you say, the subsequent seasons get better as they go.

Especially this last season with Ghost Rider and the LMDs! Best Ghost Rider ever to hit the screens!

The Fonz did it best.

*takes all the weapons away from notears*

This is just not safe.You are going to hurt yourself or someone else.

I don't know that a lot of these are animations but props that would be tied to a set of animations. So all your -chuks would use the "Nun-chucka" animation set.

Woodchucks?

Be Well!
Fireheart

notears wrote:

minions as attack animations, like maybe a necromancer could wave his hands around, and a skeleton could come out of a portal hit his target with a sword before turning into bones, or a zombie could lunge up from the ground and start grappling with his target as a hold, things like that.

MKX's Kenshi had some cool moves where he'd summon a demon for a couple swipes, then it'd disappear.